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  1. #1
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    Why VXL and not Nitro?

    Hey I'm new to RC racing and was wondering----

    Why choose a VXL over a Nitro Rustler?

    It seems to me that the nitro will go fast and cost less in the long run b/c of not having to buy batteries and chargers and what not, just fuel right?

    Thanks

  2. #2
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    A few reasons:

    Electric = Faster
    Electric = No Mess
    Electric = No after run
    Electric = No tuning, fiddling with HSN/LSN all the time
    Electric = No glow plugs to destroy
    Electric = Expensive to start with (batteries, charger etc), but they all easily outlast a nitro engine
    Electric = No noise, will not annoy people
    Electric = Maximum torque everywhere.

    The beauty of brushless is that the performance is goverened by the batteries / gearing you use, so you can have a car for all occasions.
    EMaxx MM2200-6S,Rustler VXL,Twin Detonator,L/Box

  3. #3
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    My choice was simple. The track where I run in the winter only allows electric. Keeps the noise down.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by tmaxxnutter
    A few reasons:

    Electric = Faster
    Electric = No Mess
    Electric = No after run
    Electric = No tuning, fiddling with HSN/LSN all the time
    Electric = No glow plugs to destroy
    Electric = Expensive to start with (batteries, charger etc), but they all easily outlast a nitro engine
    Electric = No noise, will not annoy people
    Electric = Maximum torque everywhere.

    The beauty of brushless is that the performance is goverened by the batteries / gearing you use, so you can have a car for all occasions.
    Good list, but I can think of one thing you forgot:
    Electric = ***** $30, gallon of nitro $25. How many times can you charge up a gallon of nitro?
    Ya can't polish fertilizer...

  5. #5
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    ^^^ +1

    Batteries will cost less than nitro in the long run

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by rag6
    Good list, but I can think of one thing you forgot:
    Electric = ***** $30, gallon of nitro $25. How many times can you charge up a gallon of nitro?
    A gallon of Traxxas nitro is 49$ here in MI at our closest hobby shop..
    When I started out I could get it for 20-25$
    I ditched the T-maxx for my Rustler and couldnt be happier...
    Chris
    XL5 Rustler -MM- money pit:)
    2.5 Maxx

  7. #7
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. rag6's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GTChris
    A gallon of Traxxas nitro is 49$ here in MI at our closest hobby shop..
    When I started out I could get it for 20-25$
    I ditched the T-maxx for my Rustler and couldnt be happier...
    Shows how long ago I ditched the nitro pede.
    Ya can't polish fertilizer...

  8. #8
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    Trust me, I've had both and electric is way easier and way more fun
    Congatulations, you just read my signature

  9. #9
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. streetdemon's Avatar
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    If it werent for brushless (and now LiPo) I think I would have stuck with nitro, but going just as fast any time you want is just too much fun.
    Some like R/C's that are fast, others like nitro

  10. #10
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    Even if you use reputable, name-brand battery packs instead of cheap ***** or ******* ones, the nitro ends up more expensive.

    Let's compare costs for a moment, totally ignoring the fancy battery charger for the electric - it'll cost a bit less than $100, which is about what it'll take to get a decent start in nitro, with spare glow plugs, after-run oil, EZ-Start batteries, receiver pack, cheap charger, fuel bottle, filter oil, and spare filter elements. We'll also ignore that nitro engines are consumables and need replaced far more often than brushless motors.

    To start the comparison, we're looking at a Rustler VXL for $300 and a Nitro Rustler for $310 - we'll call these even, as well.

    So, setting aside all the incidental costs, let's just compare power sources. Let's estimate the nitro car runs for 15 minutes on a tank. A gallon of fuel will provide 50 full 75cc tanks. That's a total of 12.5 hours of runtime per $35 jug of fuel (my local price), or $2.80 per hour. On a highly-regarded SPC 3s 8Ah LiPo, the car will run approximately an hour. At $110 per pack, in order to match the running costs of the nitro we need to get a mere 40 cycles out of our battery. A well-treated LiPo is likely to last five times that long and still give good performance - that's only 56 per hour.

    So, the nitro will cost five times as much to run and will still be slower than the electric (a VXL is advertised at 70 MPH; this is really only good for speed runs, but on conservative gearing 50 shouldn't be an issue, and it'll get there a lot faster than the nitro). Now, if you like the tweaking and tuning or noise and smell of the nitro, it's the better choice. It's also easier to run all day with - you can get two batteries for the electric, and the long-term costs work out the same way, but the up-front cost is obviously higher. However, the electric is cleaner, quieter, more reliable, and a lot less work. It's also far, far cheaper, even using high-end batteries.
    Last edited by aramid; 06-20-2009 at 03:33 PM.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by aramid
    ........
    You said it..... I do like nitro still, but not as much as before I went brushless
    Chris
    XL5 Rustler -MM- money pit:)
    2.5 Maxx

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by aramid

    So, setting aside all the incidental costs, let's just compare power sources. Let's estimate the nitro car runs for 15 minutes on a tank. A gallon of fuel will provide 50 full 75cc tanks. That's a total of 12.5 hours of runtime per $35 jug of fuel (my local price), or $2.80 per hour. On a highly-regarded SPC 3s 8Ah LiPo, the car will run approximately an hour. At $110 per pack, in order to match the running costs of the nitro we need to get a mere 40 cycles out of our battery. A well-treated LiPo is likely to last five times that long and still give good performance - that's only 56 per hour.

    So, the nitro will cost five times as much to run and will still be slower than the electric (a VXL is advertised at 70 MPH; this is really only good for speed runs, but on conservative gearing 50 shouldn't be an issue, and it'll get there a lot faster than the nitro).
    Interesting thinking except that you have no idea how long a nitro will run for on a tank. If you knew that you could re-crunch the numbers, but i bet it will still be less than an hour of run time.

    I like cars(1:1 cars).Everything about them just amazes me. I decided to get a tmaxx and it has been a giant learning experience. It is also very empowering to pull on the throttle and hear that engine rev to capacity.
    But electrics are easier to work with. The only reason i would not run my tmaxx very week because of the maintenance that had to be performed. My rustler needs very little done to it after im done running it. so i use it way more.
    Just Lax'in

  13. #13
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    Dont need but 2-3 glow plugs $15 (to start). No ARO, traxxas says you dont need it with there fuel. EZ start battey is $10 for a NICD, if you run a pull start = FREE. Dont need a revever pack or a charger, it comes in most RTR's. No need for a xtra air cleaner (for now), most RTR's come with a extra and you can wash them. Fuel is $27 bucks a gal here.

    You don't need to wait for a battery to charge, if you have multiple batteries that = more money.

    There are pros and cons in everything, it all depends on how much of a hobbiest you are. I would hate for any of you to actually get your hands dirty..
    Keep flex'in those forum keyboard muscles.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nitrotastic
    Interesting thinking except that you have no idea how long a nitro will run for on a tank.
    Nitro will run 10-15 minutes depending on how hard you are on the throttle.
    1/10 Rally.

  15. #15
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    I have an Revo 3.3, and a E-Revo brushless and haven't touched my Nitro Revo ever since. Last time I was going to use it, it didn't start (bring out the flat head screwdriver), needless to say I just automatically grab my e-revo. I will never buy another Nitro again.

  16. #16
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    elctric=expensive in beginning
    nitro=very expensive at end

    also electric is plug in and play nitro you have to buy fuel starter box fix glo plugs and other
    HV-MAXX,MM RUSTY,MERV,BAJA SS, F104,B4,MINI T

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by guzz95
    I have an Revo 3.3, and a E-Revo brushless and haven't touched my Nitro Revo ever since. Last time I was going to use it, it didn't start (bring out the flat head screwdriver).
    You should sell it to someone that knows nitro, what there doing and how to tune. There are probably thousands of people looking for a deal and know how to start a nitro RC. Put it in the market place, im sure someone will buy it and tune it properly and run it like it was made for..

    I understand your frustrations, nitro isn't for everyone.
    Keep flex'in those forum keyboard muscles.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by pede06red
    also electric is plug in and play nitro you have to buy fuel starter box fix glo plugs and other
    Oh man.... Someone lied to you or you are misinformed. You buy fuel, you dont need a starter box you can use a pull start and you dont "fix glow plugs" you replace them if need be.
    Keep flex'in those forum keyboard muscles.

  19. #19
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. NStampede Freak's Avatar
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    As much as I like my electric pede, I will never get rid of my nitro pede. I still like the fact that there is a real engine in my RC truck. To me, electric is kinda "toyish". I like my electric for when I have a few minutes and just want to plug and play. But, for all day running, nothing beats a nitro. The sound and smell will always have me keeping a nitro RC on the shelf.

    From a guy who owns both, I will still take a nitro over an electric. Electrics are still cool though, just not as cool as nitro.
    N Stampede 2.5R
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  20. #20
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    I am curious about the tradeoff between power plants; motor vs engine.
    Specifically cost and lifetime hours.

    If say, you took a roller and decided to outfit it with an engine vs a BL motor/esc, what would be the cost comparison and hours. $200 for a BL motor/esc and essentially replacing the bearings eventually (maintenance) gives a lot of runs.

    It seems like there is also an electric advantage there also - but I don't know enough about nitro to compare the numbers.
    ------
    hmmm, I've never seen it spelled that way.

  21. #21
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    An engine lasts a owner who runs it right about...5-7 gallons of fuel, a brushless motor(from my ixperience with drag racers) 1-10 passes before they blow a motor shaft lol. But for a brushless motor its prety much the life of the vehicle. And to those who say that nitro is "messy"...it is not and I havve no Idea what yall are doing. Once you have set a tune(not that hard and im 14...) it just takes minor adjustments each day you run it...and if you have run the fuel out of the engine(started it after you pull off the line) you don't really need afterrun unless your storing it longer than say 5 days. But a given you should be more mechanically inclined with nitro. Know how engines work and have taken Freshman level sience to further understand how the engine works(that is just to help you understand how it works and so you can maintain it yourself more proficiently) but that is not at all needed, just seems that after I knew that stuff nitro was easy. Personally I like nitro much more than electric, and in racing its the dominant form(1/8 buggy, monster truck...the stuff that gets all the attention). But electric will alwayse be easier for people to use...just plug and play.
    R/C is expensive...

  22. #22
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    I've got both nitros (Tmaxx and RC10GT) and a Rustler VXL. Cost-wise, I don't really think there is much difference.

    The thing that I like about the new Rustler VXL is the ease of use and lack of maintenance. These days, I like to get it out with my kids to play around (almost 5 and nearly 2). Getting the nitro packed up, all of the tools and pieces and heading out to a park or our nearby track is a bit of a pain.

    A typical nitro run goes like this
    0). Be sure my receiver pack is charged in the truck and my controller is charged.
    1). get the truck out and richen up the fuel mixture and turn up the idle a bit to start
    2). get my glow starter on my RC10GT or my battery pack for my EZ start on my Maxx
    3). Add fuel
    4). Get the truck started, wait for it to warm up a bit
    5). Start turning down the high-end mixture and the idle and get the idle down
    6). Run it for a few minutes and monitor engine temps till it's running in it's sweet spot.
    7). Run the truck as long as I want and just add fuel
    8). When done, run fuel out of tank and put in after run oil.
    9). Clean oily residue and dirt of side of truck from exhaust and off tires.
    10). Pack everything back in toolbox.

    Now, on the other hand, running my electric goes something like this.
    1). put battery pack on charger at 2a for about 2 hours sometime prior to running truck
    2). make sure receiver batteries are charged.
    3). put battery in car, gun throttle and drive for about 30-40 minutes until battery is drained.
    4). put second battery in car if desired.
    5). when down, turn off car and radio and put in trunk of car.

    Each are great in their own right. But I'm absolutely thrilled with my new brushless Rustler after years of running nothing but nitro.

  23. #23
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    Back in the day, if you wanted power, you ran nitro. If you wanted easy, you ran electric. Now you can have both with brushless, especially with LiPo.
    RustyVXL, HPI RS4 Rally, RC18MT
    Mobius1 crashed!

  24. #24
    RC Turnbuckle Jr.
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    rc k1d drag racing is far different. i have a drag car and have blown 2 spurs, 1 pinion, and 2 tires. now counting all my other rc's i have like 10 stripped spurs in 2 years and with around 40 vehicles. 1 blown tire and no blown pinions. oh and i have yet to get my funny car up to top speed and have yet to take it to a track. there really is no competition. electric is far less of a hassle. and with todays top vehicles..........................well if i am not mistaken i believe the savage flux and e-revo brushless and rustler vxl and firestorm flux are all quicker than the nitro versions of the models. oh and on top of all that nitros can be tempermental. sometiems my buddies who run nitro alot have had issues kepeing vehicles going or even getting them started. oh and my funny car has only been outside like 3 or 4 times.
    Last edited by 69Malibu; 06-20-2009 at 11:47 PM.
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  25. #25
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Dadx2mj's Avatar
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    My son who has been a nitro head for about the last year is finally seeing the light. He is now selling off all his nitro with the exception of his Losi Eight and he plans on converting that to a brushless set up. I think when my Rusty on a 2s smoked his Losi doing a wheel stand the hole way he started re thinking things.

    The only things I like about nitro is the smell of the exhaust. In every other way a brushless system seems to be the winner in my book. The brushless is faster, easier to maintain, more dependable, you can run them anywhere, the list just goes on and on.
    BlindMan Racing
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  26. #26
    RC Turnbuckle Jr.
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    EXACTLY. nitros seem cool but electrics are stealing the spotlight. after all look at the fastest rc. electric powered. not nitro. look at crawling. electric no nitro. nearly every single time i have taken any of my nitros out they have issues. whereas my electrics have very few issues.
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  27. #27
    Marshal ksb51rl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 69Malibu
    ..nearly every single time i have taken any of my nitros out they have issues. whereas my electrics have very few issues.
    Until they get crashed repeatedly and purposely into large rocks.
    Alt-248 on the number pad =

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by ksb51rl
    Until they get crashed repeatedly and purposely into large rocks.
    User error? You need to go for heavier things that make a bigger sound when hit


    Nitro will run 10-15 minutes depending on how hard you are on the throttle.
    Is this from personal experience? If not where are you getting this information from? And more specifically i was talking directly to aramid's point. This is probably one of the rare occasions where you have to have experience to comment on. And im sure you have experience Donny but every motor runs different. Nitro motors cannot be covered in an blanket statement.

    I really wonder what the next innovation is going to be for electrics. Brushless and Lipo (and all forms of Lithium) are relatively young compared to the hobby and there is still room to grow(and get faster )
    Just Lax'in

  29. #29
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. streetdemon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pparks1
    I've got both nitros (Tmaxx and RC10GT) and a Rustler VXL. Cost-wise, I don't really think there is much difference.

    The thing that I like about the new Rustler VXL is the ease of use and lack of maintenance. These days, I like to get it out with my kids to play around (almost 5 and nearly 2). Getting the nitro packed up, all of the tools and pieces and heading out to a park or our nearby track is a bit of a pain.

    A typical nitro run goes like this
    0). Be sure my receiver pack is charged in the truck and my controller is charged.
    1). get the truck out and richen up the fuel mixture and turn up the idle a bit to start
    2). get my glow starter on my RC10GT or my battery pack for my EZ start on my Maxx
    3). Add fuel
    4). Get the truck started, wait for it to warm up a bit
    5). Start turning down the high-end mixture and the idle and get the idle down
    6). Run it for a few minutes and monitor engine temps till it's running in it's sweet spot.
    7). Run the truck as long as I want and just add fuel
    8). When done, run fuel out of tank and put in after run oil.
    9). Clean oily residue and dirt of side of truck from exhaust and off tires.
    10). Pack everything back in toolbox.

    Now, on the other hand, running my electric goes something like this.
    1). put battery pack on charger at 2a for about 2 hours sometime prior to running truck
    2). make sure receiver batteries are charged.
    3). put battery in car, gun throttle and drive for about 30-40 minutes until battery is drained.
    4). put second battery in car if desired.
    5). when down, turn off car and radio and put in trunk of car.

    Each are great in their own right. But I'm absolutely thrilled with my new brushless Rustler after years of running nothing but nitro.

    Why are you charging at only 2 amps? Also, since when do electric cars have reciever packs? Did you mean transmitter batteries? If thats the case then you should add that to your nitro list.


    And to whoever said nitro isn't messy, it is. The oils in the fuel get everywhere and that in turn attracts dirt. Even on-road nitros get dirty.
    Some like R/C's that are fast, others like nitro

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dadx2mj
    The only things I like about nitro is the smell of the exhaust.
    Perhaps you could introduce a new product on the market, Dad, so that electric RC folks can enjoy the smell of nitro fuel as well... Something like a nitro-soaked stick-on moustache. That would be the ultimate RC experience!
    Two Rusty VXLs, M2Ks 18/83 - Tag! You're it!

  31. #31
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    or nitro scented after-shave

  32. #32
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    I like both,but electric is definatly easier to play with.But there are time's when i want to just make noise and smell the fumes.Both are alot of fun.
    To upgrade or not to upgrade,is that even a question?

  33. #33
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. danielhr77's Avatar
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    I got my ERBE with four 3S 5000 ***** batteries two months ago and I haven't driven any of my others R/Cs since then... And, I own a few... Absolutely nothing compares to a powerful brushless... My second favorite is the Rustler VXL...
    Last edited by danielhr77; 06-21-2009 at 05:18 AM.
    He Who Dies With the Most Toys Wins.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by StamJato
    Back in the day, if you wanted power, you ran nitro. If you wanted easy, you ran electric. Now you can have both with brushless, especially with LiPo.
    Wow that is exactly what I said as a reply to on a you tube comment.

    And as for going nitro or electric, let me just say that I had a nitro boat that I could never even get running, so I sold it and bought a rustler and got it up and running in about 20min.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by streetdemon
    Why are you charging at only 2 amps?
    Because I've got the time and it's easier on the batteries. I'm running EnerG 4600mah packs and they last almost 40 minutes....so I don't often drive through more than 1 or 2 packs at any setting...so the slow 2.5 hour charge time is no problem. I've also got a few chargers as well, so I can bring up 2 packs at once. I'm just backyard bashing and playing with my kids....so serious charging is not required. I realize that I can charge these cells in about an hour at 4.6a or more...but I just don't have the need.

    Quote Originally Posted by streetdemon
    Also, since when do electric cars have reciever packs? Did you mean transmitter batteries? If thats the case then you should add that to your nitro list.
    You are absolutely correct, I meant transmitter batteries. Too bad I cannot go back and modify my list...but it's been too long since my post.
    Last edited by pparks1; 06-21-2009 at 10:37 AM.

  36. #36
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    The Nitro sound

    Wouldn't it be great if someone came up with a Nitro sound simulator? LOL

    I haven't tried nitro but I will in the future. At this point, electric is a lot easier especially if you have kids and other family members/friends and want them to play.
    Home of the Cheap Brushless Rustler!

  37. #37
    RC Turnbuckle Jr.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ksb51rl
    Until they get crashed repeatedly and purposely into large rocks.
    hey that only happened once. however i came within an inch of hititng my buddies slash at top speed with my slayer. on purpose. he wanted me to hit the truck. and there was no way i could resist.
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  38. #38
    Marshal ksb51rl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 69Malibu
    hey that only happened once. however i came within an inch of hititng my buddies slash at top speed with my slayer. on purpose. he wanted me to hit the truck. and there was no way i could resist.
    By all means, be a good friend.
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  39. #39
    RC Turnbuckle Jr.
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    i was. i missed on my first try and my slayer ran out of fuel before i could make a second attempt. anyways guys lets get back on topic. before mods show up.
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  40. #40
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    im nitro and electric...i think nitro is better...because out of the box nitro is a lot faster........you have to spend all of that money for a lipo,balancer,charger...and the lipo can blow up and in my oponion with nitor you have tourque and hp you cant do that with electric
    if its fast its a rustler

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