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  1. #41
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Briber's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drty420 View Post
    Thanks briber... this was most helpful. Always good info here.
    Your welcome, I agree!

    Quote Originally Posted by powerpickle View Post
    How long does it take out of curiosity? I have a 5000mah 2s,I charge it at 4 amps and it takes 45-50 min every time.
    1:40 to charge my 3300mah 2s @ 1A. I will charge at 2A next time.

    Can you fast charge in balance mode?
    Last edited by Briber; 01-22-2016 at 08:06 PM.
    Just need one more rc, then Ill be done...

  2. #42
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. jvogel's Avatar
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    Charge rating (capital “C”): This is how fast you can charge the battery. Now, this number is usually not listed. This is because most people aren’t interested in quickly charging their batteries since this puts a strain on them and shortens their life significantly. Most experienced hobbyists interested in getting the longest life out of their LiPo packs charge them at 1 amp/cell.

    Discharge rating (usually a small “c”): This is how fast a battery can be discharged safely. A high powered motor can damage or even burn up (fire) a battery with too low of a discharge rate. But buying a battery with a really high discharge rate would be a huge waste of money if your motor can’t use it.

    All of the Traxxas LiPo packs on their website are 25c I believe.

    Hope this helps.
    Obstacle Magnet

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by jvogel View Post
    Charge rating (capital C): This is how fast you can charge the battery. Now, this number is usually not listed. This is because most people arent interested in quickly charging their batteries since this puts a strain on them and shortens their life significantly. Most experienced hobbyists interested in getting the longest life out of their LiPo packs charge them at 1 amp/cell.

    Discharge rating (usually a small c): This is how fast a battery can be discharged safely. A high powered motor can damage or even burn up (fire) a battery with too low of a discharge rate. But buying a battery with a really high discharge rate would be a huge waste of money if your motor cant use it.

    All of the Traxxas LiPo packs on their website are 25c I believe.

    Hope this helps.
    Fantastic info, thank you for adding that!
    Just need one more rc, then Ill be done...

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by jvogel View Post
    Charge rating (capital C): This is how fast you can charge the battery. Now, this number is usually not listed. This is because most people arent interested in quickly charging their batteries since this puts a strain on them and shortens their life significantly. Most experienced hobbyists interested in getting the longest life out of their LiPo packs charge them at 1 amp/cell.

    Discharge rating (usually a small c): This is how fast a battery can be discharged safely. A high powered motor can damage or even burn up (fire) a battery with too low of a discharge rate. But buying a battery with a really high discharge rate would be a huge waste of money if your motor cant use it.

    All of the Traxxas LiPo packs on their website are 25c I believe.

    Hope this helps.
    1 amp/cell?
    Alt-248 on the number pad =

  5. #45
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. jvogel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jvogel View Post
    Most experienced hobbyists interested in getting the longest life out of their LiPo packs charge them at 1 amp/cell.
    Yeap, typo-city. "1 amp/cell" should read "1c" I love cut and paste mistakes. Obviously. Since I make them so often!

    Easier to give examples since I can't find the jargon:

    If charging a 4000mah (4 amp) lipo pack at 1C, you would be charging it at 4 amps.

    If charging a 4000mah (4 amp) lipo pack at 5C, you would be charging it at 20 amps.

    If charging a 5000mah (5 amp) lipo pack at 1C, you would be charging it at 5 amps.
    Obstacle Magnet

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by jvogel View Post
    Yeap, typo-city. "1 amp/cell" should read "1c" I love cut and paste mistakes. Obviously. Since I make them so often!

    Easier to give examples since I can't find the jargon:

    If charging a 4000mah (4 amp) lipo pack at 1C, you would be charging it at 4 amps.

    If charging a 4000mah (4 amp) lipo pack at 5C, you would be charging it at 20 amps.

    If charging a 5000mah (5 amp) lipo pack at 1C, you would be charging it at 5 amps.
    This is awesome info. I typically charge my 5800maw 2s lipos at 3amps unless I want to use them right away then I charge at 4 amps. I use traxxas ID batteries with the newest traxxas Id charger. Almost all traxxas batteries have a 25C discharge rating. I assume if they needed more for their applications then they would make them. I don't race I just thrash around the yard and woods so I guess the discharge rating is not really something I need to worry about. Thank to everyone who has contributed here this is most useful info for all.

  7. #47
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. jvogel's Avatar
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    More than welcome Drty420. Obviously you can charge your 5800mah pack at 5.8 amps - that's 1C for that LiPo pack. I don't know of any reason to charge at a rate lower than 1C. For a discharge rate, 25c may be insufficient for a higher powered system you may want to install in your RC later on. I have this odd need to overpower all of my bash trucks with ridiculously mighty Castle systems. RC is an addiction --- a healthy addiction.

    After all these years, I still get the "c" and "C" mixed up.
    Obstacle Magnet

  8. #48
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Briber's Avatar
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    Both my lipos fit in my truck double stacked with leads sticking up under body. Ive been running one until it dies then switching it. I bought the Trx connectors to make a Y splitter.

    I wanted to confirm I can wire those in parallel and it won't affect voltage right?

    Is there a chance I could hurt batteries?

    Should I change low voltage cut off?

    Any and all info is appreciated.
    Just need one more rc, then Ill be done...

  9. #49
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. jvogel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Briber View Post
    Both my lipos fit in my truck double stacked with leads sticking up under body. Ive been running one until it dies then switching it. I bought the Trx connectors to make a Y splitter.

    I wanted to confirm I can wire those in parallel and it won't affect voltage right?

    Is there a chance I could hurt batteries?

    Should I change low voltage cut off?

    Any and all info is appreciated.
    Connecting in Series:
    Doubling the voltage while maintaining the same capacity rating (amp hours). This will burn up a stock system.

    Connecting in Parallel:
    Doubling the capacity (amp hours) of the battery while maintaining the voltage of one of the individual batteries.

    I wouldn't bother having my P4de lug around two packs. You are really straining the truck with the unnecessary added weight of a second pack, gaining nothing, and you're getting a higher center of gravity which isn't a good thing either. Just swap the battery packs once one is depleted.

    Your stock Traxxas VXL-3s ESC's LiPo Low Voltage Detection (LVD) is sufficient. LVD is active when the light on the ESC is green.

    Hope this helps you.
    Obstacle Magnet

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by jvogel View Post
    Connecting in Series:
    Doubling the voltage while maintaining the same capacity rating (amp hours). This will burn up a stock system.

    Connecting in Parallel:
    Doubling the capacity (amp hours) of the battery while maintaining the voltage of one of the individual batteries.

    I wouldn't bother having my P4de lug around two packs. You are really straining the truck with the unnecessary added weight of a second pack, gaining nothing, and you're getting a higher center of gravity which isn't a good thing either. Just swap the battery packs once one is depleted.

    Your stock Traxxas VXL-3s ESC's LiPo Low Voltage Detection (LVD) is sufficient. LVD is active when the light on the ESC is green.

    Hope this helps you.
    It helps greatly, thank you. I have 2-3300mah 30-40C batteries. With only one battery neither one of battery hold downs will hold one battery tight. If I put both on there the higher one holds both nice and secure. I have a castle SCT combo in there geared up to 18/54. It at half throttle roughly 20-30 mph will pull wheelies if I pull wot so I don't think the batteries are weighing it down to much but I will def keep that in mind if I go with bigger mah batts.

    I'm assuming higher mah batts weigh more?
    Just need one more rc, then Ill be done...

  11. #51
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. jvogel's Avatar
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    Yes. More mAh = more weight. But, there are more considerations: price, case type, etc.

    A 2S 2500mAh 50C SPC LiPo soft case is 120 grams and $20.
    A 2S 5000mAh 40C SPC LiPo hard case is 265 grams and $28.
    A 2S 5600mAh 60C SPC LiPo soft case is 282 grams and $41.
    The hard case is better value and the safer choice too.

    Here's how I hold my LiPo packs in the P4de tray:



    Velcro from a fabric shop. It cost pennies and holds like a million.
    Obstacle Magnet

  12. #52
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Briber's Avatar
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    2 times I've went out and relatively quickly or almost immediately vehicle goes to low voltage cutoff with one of my lipos. Also 2 times now my charger has timed out half way through changing. Am I charging at to low of amps if its taking so long my charger times out? Because its doing that am I hurting the battery? When I restart it finishes charging just fine.
    Just need one more rc, then Ill be done...

  13. #53
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    I use a traxxas 3s 6400mah 11.1 lipo and have zero regrets!!! 95.00 bucks on Amazon.

  14. #54
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Briber's Avatar
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    2X Lipo Fun!
    Just need one more rc, then Ill be done...

  15. #55
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. jvogel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jsledgerwood View Post
    I use a traxxas 3s 6400mah 11.1 lipo and have zero regrets!!! 95.00 bucks on Amazon.
    Traxxas LiPo packs are top notch but waaaaaaaaaaay pricey.
    SMC 3s 7200mAh 11.1 LiPo $60.
    They have a much higher C rating too.
    http://www.smc-racing.net
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  16. #56
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    Wow do I have a lot to learn. I just killed my 3s pack on my Pede. I use a Prophet Sport Duo duo to charge my batteries and have been charging them at way to high of an amperage. I just plugged in the 3s to charge and got the dreaded inbalanced or dead cell error. I thought the truck was in Lipo mode but maybe I've switched it back to nickel, seems easy to do by mistake. Being colorblind doesn't help much.

    I need to slow down and research more thoroughly before I just jump right in! The LHS I bought the packs at didn't do me any favors though, pretty much no advice at all on governing what rate you charge at. Live and learn I guess. I'm a little confused on voltage outputs between Lipo and Nimh. My VXL basically crawls with the 7.4V 2s batteries. My boys and their brushed 4x4 Pede's tear it up with the 8.4V NiMh batteries. So naturally I go looking for a higher voltage 2s but that doesn't seem to be an option for me or a lower than 11.1V 3s...no dice. Makes me want to run the nickel stuff even though it dies faster. I'm always paranoid about destroying things when I run 3s and usually do like today when I split one of my bodies all the way up one side, but running at 7.4 volts is boring by comparison. Am I missing something? Doing something wrong? (most likely)

    Oh well, if I'm going to kill a 3s might as well be a good run!

  17. #57
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. jvogel's Avatar
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    Wow CounterTrey, I had the exact opposite reaction when I switched from 8.4V NiMH to 7.4V LiPo those many years ago. LiPo blew the doors off NiMH in every way. Maybe the LiPo you are using for comparison is poor quality or there's some other variable going on.
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  18. #58
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    Going lipo, recommendations?

    Yea that's what I'm thinking, it HAS to be because my kids' brushed Pedes were running circles around my VXL with a 2s in it today. I'm thinking I've probably damaged some Lipo batteries pretty badly with my idiotic charging methods. So frustrated with myself....like a little kid. Cripes!

    Traxxas has a strict language policy. A word filter operates to change inappropriate words and banned websites or brands to *s. When you see these in your post, you MUST edit them out.
    ksb51rl
    Last edited by ksb51rl; 01-31-2016 at 08:23 AM.

  19. #59
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. jvogel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CounterTrey View Post
    I'm thinking I've probably damaged some Lipo batteries pretty badly with my idiotic charging methods. So frustrated with myself...
    Hey, we all make mistakes. Since I'm totally geek-brainiac-nerdy, I take really good care of my packs. Other guys, not so much. My friends wonder why my packs last so much longer than theirs. Of course, I had to learn all of this stuff the hard way ($)!
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  20. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Briber View Post
    Your welcome, I agree!


    1:40 to charge my 3300mah 2s @ 1A. I will charge at 2A next time.

    Can you fast charge in balance mode?
    You will be fine charging at 2 amps if you want.
    I don't believe that any charger will allow fast charging with the balance post connected and I wouldn't even if possible.
    I always balance charge so I know that the cells are equal and balance charging at a lower rate than the max possible the battery can handle will keep the battery healthy and maintain longevity.

  21. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Briber View Post
    2 times I've went out and relatively quickly or almost immediately vehicle goes to low voltage cutoff with one of my lipos. Also 2 times now my charger has timed out half way through changing. Am I charging at to low of amps if its taking so long my charger times out? Because its doing that am I hurting the battery? When I restart it finishes charging just fine.

    I don't see how that will hurt a battery. I do wonder if one of your batteries is worn out since you hit lvc quickly. That happening suggests one of them isn't full/one of the cells isn't reaching full voltage. Example: one cell is 4.2 and the other is 3.8 with an lvc cut off of 3.6
    Is either battery warm-hot after charging or running while the other isn't?
    Are both batteries of the same specs?

  22. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by powerpickle View Post
    I don't see how that will hurt a battery. I do wonder if one of your batteries is worn out since you hit lvc quickly. That happening suggests one of them isn't full/one of the cells isn't reaching full voltage. Example: one cell is 4.2 and the other is 3.8 with an lvc cut off of 3.6
    Is either battery warm-hot after charging or running while the other isn't?
    Are both batteries of the same specs?
    They are both 3300mah 2s. Same manufacturer. I don't know what was going on with that one battery. I bought off someone else and who knows when the last time it was ran.

    After running several cycles through each battery they are both the same now. I get 10-14 minutes runtime on each or 20-25 minutes when running on both at the same time, depending on how I'm running it.

    I've done a charge test multiple times and here's what I came up with.

    Charging @
    1A 1:40
    2A 1:10
    3A 50 min
    4A 40 min

    Special note here:

    The performance/runtime was different with the 4A charge. It seemed to be slightly less by 3-5 min, even though charger seemed to balance charge fine with no error codes. Obviously I can't perfectly repeat same driving conditions. I don't think the faster charge by 10 min is worth it.

    My batteries have a 2c charge rating. From what I've read I could charge them as high as 6A however my charger only goes to 4A.
    Just need one more rc, then Ill be done...

  23. #63
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    SPC or SMC are goo batteries to get.

  24. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miltdoggie View Post
    SPC or SMC are goo batteries to get.
    W/tax return $ I'm getting new ones. These were good cheap price I couldn't pass up to get my feet wet with. Lol

    I'll pass these down to daughter when I get new ones.
    Just need one more rc, then Ill be done...

  25. #65
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    This turned out so good!!!
    Just need one more rc, then Ill be done...

  26. #66
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    Nuts.

    Well I seem to have resurrected my dead 3s. Local LHS adivsed of a possible way to do it but it made me nervous even trying it so I passed. They wanted me to hook it up in NiMh mode until it gets to 5 volts then unplug and switch it to lipo. It seems that the balancing is what causes the issue. I run a Horizon Hobby Prophet Sport Duo



    ...and it has a fast charge Lipo mode which I discovered this morning bypasses the balancer and charges straight. Same thing as the NiMh mode but without the higher charge rate that leads to Lipo explosions.. So it's working! Key question is how long it will last now, I'm betting it has damaged cells and the life is going to be significantly affected.

  27. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by CounterTrey View Post
    Nuts.

    Well I seem to have resurrected my dead 3s. Local LHS adivsed of a possible way to do it but it made me nervous even trying it so I passed. They wanted me to hook it up in NiMh mode until it gets to 5 volts then unplug and switch it to lipo. It seems that the balancing is what causes the issue. I run a Horizon Hobby Prophet Sport Duo.
    How could balancing have caused the problem?

    If you are trying to recover the pack using the NIMH charge, it sounds like the pack was over discharged.

  28. #68
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. jvogel's Avatar
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    I always balance charge at 1C. Fast charging, and/or not balance charging, will significantly shorten a LiPo's life.
    Last edited by jvogel; 02-01-2016 at 12:38 PM.
    Obstacle Magnet

  29. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by jvogel View Post
    I always balance charge at 1C! Fast charging, and/or not balance charging, will significantly shorten a LiPo's life.
    If charging @ 1A and almost 2 hrs go by and I check on it to find out it timed out and is only half charged then its unrealistic to me to keep trying charge it that way. I respect your opinion and do agree slower is better. :-)
    Just need one more rc, then Ill be done...

  30. #70
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    Yea Jakey that's exactly what it seems like but my charger was giving me an error code telling me it was either imbalanced or had a dead cell. I figure this battery is already toast because of my prior stupidity charging at too high of a rate, so one charge on fast mode probably isn't going to be that horrible. The truck was in Lipo mode yesterday, it stopped when the charge got low and then when I went to charge I got the error. Am I running my Lipos too low? Since they don't really show signs of discharge I've just been letting the truck indicate when it's charge time.

    It's weird, the battery had a nice long run that charge. No signs of any issues until now. I'm enough of a rookie with the new batteries that I'm probably making all kinds of incorrect assumptions and way too nervous to try some of the "tricks" the racers at the LHS were offering up as options.

  31. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Briber View Post
    If charging @ 1A and almost 2 hrs go by and I check on it to find out it timed out and is only half charged then its unrealistic to me to keep trying charge it that way. I respect your opinion and do agree slower is better. :-)
    jvogel posted "1C" (= 3.3 Amps for a 3300mAh pack) not "1A".
    Alt-248 on the number pad =

  32. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by ksb51rl View Post
    jvogel posted "1C" (= 3.3 Amps for a 3300mAh pack) not "1A".
    I'm confused my charger says 1A, 2A, 3A, and 4A. So setting it for 2A means I'm charging @ 6.6 Amps? Then why not label it 1C, 2C etc.? I assumed A= Amps on charger.

    My batt manufacturer list a 2c charge rating for my batteries.
    Last edited by Briber; 02-01-2016 at 12:50 PM.
    Just need one more rc, then Ill be done...

  33. #73
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. jvogel's Avatar
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    ksb51rl is right twice over.

    My original typo (ksb51rl noted it) made things worse but I tried to fix it in my post #45.


    So, if charging a 3300mAh LiPo battery pack at 1C, you would be charging it at 3.3 Amps.

    If you are charging this pack at only 1 Amp, and not 3.3 Amps, then your charger probably will time out.
    Obstacle Magnet

  34. #74
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    I forgot to mention that the battery in question is obviously a cheap POS, I can't even figure out what brand it is.

    And sorry to the admins for my language faux pas, the word in question is one that is generally considered G rated but an expression of frustration from the 1920's. I'm surprised it was a flagged word. This also the first I've seen a forum requiring editing after a filter already did it for you...and I'm a designer. Oh well live and learn!

  35. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by jvogel View Post
    ksb51rl is right twice over.

    My original typo (ksb51rl noted it) made things worse but I tried to fix it in my post #45.


    So, if charging a 3300mAh LiPo battery pack at 1C, you would be charging it at 3.3 Amps.

    If you are charging this pack at only 1 Amp, and not 3.3 Amps, then your charger probably will time out.
    Correct!, my friend that's what happens. So if I get a charger capable of 6.6A charging will that reduce battery life enough to be concerned about vs charging at 3A all the time?
    Last edited by Briber; 02-01-2016 at 12:57 PM.
    Just need one more rc, then Ill be done...

  36. #76
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. jvogel's Avatar
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    Briber, I think the confusion may be caused by a limitation of your charger. Most chargers can go from 0.1 Amps to 6.0 Amps or more. What charger are you using?
    Obstacle Magnet

  37. #77
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    If the charger is giving any type of low voltage error or bad connection error, I would bet the pack was over discharged. Believe it or not.

  38. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by jvogel View Post
    Briber, I think the confusion may be caused by a limitation of your charger. Most chargers can go from 0.1 Amps to 6.0 Amps or more. What charger are you using?
    Traxxas single port. I'm upgrading with tax return $, so before I do my question is: is 6A perfectly acceptable charge rate or will it still reduce batt life expectancy, before I purchase something I can't use fully use due to reducing batt life, even though my batt has 2c rating?
    Last edited by Briber; 02-01-2016 at 01:25 PM.
    Just need one more rc, then Ill be done...

  39. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jakey View Post
    If the charger is giving any type of low voltage error or bad connection error, I would bet the pack was over discharged. Believe it or not.
    That sounds right to me too Jakey. Question to follow are:

    What does that mean for the use of the battery, anything to worry about other than it losing charge capacity/life?

    Also if the truck is in Lipo mode isn't that supposed to prevent over-discharge?

    If it's not in Lipo mode will it keep running and then just stop dead or will it get a bit weak towards the end?

    I know the nickel batteries show an obvious gradual loss of power but haven't experienced that with the Lipo. The VXL has an audible beep response when it goes into Lipo, so I don't worry much about the color of the LED, seriously I can't tell which is green or red, I'm red/'green color blind. I have to have the Boys look at their brushed Pedes to help me indicate the mode with those. Don't laugh!!!

  40. #80
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. jvogel's Avatar
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    I think I'm a bit color blind too. It took me a couple dates with this voluptuous gal before I realized her eyes were blue.
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