Results 1 to 34 of 34
  1. #1
    RC Qualifier spunkybob's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Posts
    605

    Having issues with MIP X-Dutys

    Hi all.

    I finally got my xduties installed on my 4x4.
    I had to sand the front caster blocks to make them fit etc, but for some reason when I put the power down it makes a strange sound from the motor before taking off.

    I'm talking that electric humm.

    There doesn't seem to be any binding and otherwise seems to be as normal.

    Would it be possible that due to the extra weight etc. my 3800kv 4p motor is now no longer adequate due to the extra rotating mass etc?

    I was thinking getting a 2100kv motor but I only have 2s lipos and can't really afford more at the moment.



    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

  2. #2
    RC Turnbuckle Jr.
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Posts
    9,398
    If it is on 2s, a 3800 is really underpowered. Those x duries weigh 3x more than stock

  3. #3
    RC Champion shack351's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Kville
    Posts
    1,127
    Hey Spunky,

    If you did not have the sound before the axle swap then something else is likely wrong. In and of itself, changing axles should not cause that problem. Something else has changed. You say there is no binding (rotational binding?) so your motor shouldn't even know the axles were changed. I think you might be binding somewhere, likely in the rear.

    Get your truck setup up on a bench/table with the tires removed. Prop it up so that that your free spinning. Power it on and gradually apply throttle. Listen CLOSELY at each corner for any abnormality. I don't know what exact model truck you have but I will say with certainty that I could not install X-Duties on either of my Platinums WITH THE INCLUDED WASHERS/SPACERS in the configuration that is listed in the instruction sheet and not have slop. It's no rocket science to look at a picture and install the kit as shown. I spent hours trying a variety of combinations and could not get the parts to fit perfect in the recommended orientation. Keep in mind that I am trying to reduce any and all slop in every component. I ended up with a nice, tight (but not overly tight) fit on my trucks. I ultimately could not use part #10127.

    Your setup is probably not like mine but you should not have seen a change like what you described from merely changing axles. They are heavier, yes, but not enough to change the sound and/or performance of your motor. I slapped X-Duties on a stock Platinum and there was absolutely ZERO difference in anything except for my piece of mind in knowing the axles aren't gonna be the next part to break!

    Good luck!

    -Shack
    Last edited by shack351; 03-29-2017 at 02:46 AM.

  4. #4
    RC Qualifier spunkybob's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Posts
    605
    Wow man, thanks.

    Before work today I checked the supplied wheel hex's which I did in nice and tight but thought maybe that was the issue so I undid the grub screw on them and installed the wheels again and it didn't make any difference.

    I installed them into the bearing carriers before putting them back on the truck and they were freely spinning.

    I did notice my spur gear is able to slide back and forward a few mm.. I wonder if this could be causing it.

    I never noticed it before but I wonder if it's always done it.

    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

  5. #5
    RC Qualifier spunkybob's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Posts
    605
    Ok so I did some troubleshooting and it seems to only happen when the wheels are on and at the rear.

    Going to completely pull apart the rear and see what the go is.

    I waited 3 weeks for the MIPs from the US and I still can't use it lol!

    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

  6. #6
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. Squeegie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    7,589
    Are you sure you have the bearing spacers where they are supposed to be? Front and rear are assembled differently. Fronts don't need them!

    Creativity is intelligence having fun. -Einstein

  7. #7
    RC Racer
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Ashley, MI
    Posts
    207
    Quote Originally Posted by spunkybob View Post
    Hi all.

    I finally got my xduties installed on my 4x4.
    I had to sand the front caster blocks to make them fit etc, but for some reason when I put the power down it makes a strange sound from the motor before taking off.

    I'm talking that electric humm.

    There doesn't seem to be any binding and otherwise seems to be as normal.

    Would it be possible that due to the extra weight etc. my 3800kv 4p motor is now no longer adequate due to the extra rotating mass etc?

    I was thinking getting a 2100kv motor but I only have 2s lipos and can't really afford more at the moment.



    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
    I run MIP X-dutys in my 4x4 no problem and I have a 4900kv motor so it shouldn't be under powered causing the noise.

  8. #8
    RC Qualifier spunkybob's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Posts
    605
    Ok I think i worked out the issue.
    Seems that the bearing on the rear pinion gear is all kinds of messed up (slides back and forward etc) and was causing it to be meshed to tightly to the Differential Ring under hard acceleration.

    Bummer since its a new plaig bearing which are meant to be good quality.

    I cleaned it out a bit and threw it back in and now its working heaps good.

    Had a good bash at the local beach park in the wet this morning

    [/URL]

  9. #9
    RC Champion shack351's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Kville
    Posts
    1,127
    Quote Originally Posted by spunkybob View Post
    Wow man, thanks.

    Before work today I checked the supplied wheel hex's which I did in nice and tight but thought maybe that was the issue so I undid the grub screw on them and installed the wheels again and it didn't make any difference.

    I installed them into the bearing carriers before putting them back on the truck and they were freely spinning.

    I did notice my spur gear is able to slide back and forward a few mm.. I wonder if this could be causing it.

    I never noticed it before but I wonder if it's always done it.

    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

    Hey Spunky,

    I'm happy to see that you got it figured out! Looks like you had some serious fun today! When you can, I would at least pull your rear tranny/diff apart and inspect everything thoroughly. Don't know how old your truck is or how many hours you have on it but the slop you mentioned probably isn't good! Something needs some TLC.

    I have noticed the same issue of excessive travel/slop with the front pinion (TRX5379X I believe) and it is present on both the Platinums that I have looked at. I have a busy weekend ahead but I am going to try and paint the diff ring to see exactly what my mesh looks like when at both extremes of the movement, in and out. Right now when at it's most inward position, you can easily tell that the gears are not meshing right and there is binding. Move it out just a bit and it is nice and quiet. Move it to its most outward travel position and it is still quiet but now you have to realize that you probably have a skinny mesh with the ring and that's not good either. The sweet-spot is somewhere in the middle of the travel which may be a little tricky to tweak. One definite thing to make sure of is that the pinion is not resting all the way inward and putting any excess pressure on the ring. If this happens, you will be visiting Bind City real quick. It's a PITA because there is no built-into-the-design way to change this. I haven't gotten down and dirty on it yet but will report the findings when done.

    -Shack

  10. #10
    RC Qualifier spunkybob's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Posts
    605
    What i don't like about the design is that there is nothing built in to stop the pinion from sliding. its only held in by friction on the bearing.

    So his in itself is a problem.

  11. #11
    RC Qualifier ljl23's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2016
    Location
    Colorado USA
    Posts
    257
    Quote Originally Posted by spunkybob View Post
    What i don't like about the design is that there is nothing built in to stop the pinion from sliding. its only held in by friction on the bearing.

    So his in itself is a problem.
    Having the same issue with mine, even on my STRC chassis. I wonder if there's some sort of spacer that could work


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Slash 4x4 and Slash VXL owner

  12. #12
    RC Qualifier spunkybob's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Posts
    605
    What it should be is the spur shaft should have a pin to hold the pinion on instead of it just floating there.

    Would make maintenance a little harder but a much better design.

    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

  13. #13
    RC Qualifier spunkybob's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Posts
    605
    Also.. my rear wheels were causing binding also.. they are proline trenchers on proline rims and if I did them up tight I was unable to spin them.

    So I added a Teflon washer between the hex and the rim (putting between the hex and the bearing did not work) and that added enough so they no longer bind.

    I have no idea why, and I have the MIP spacers in all the right locations.

    Maybe it's the RPM rear carriers flexing or compressing while tightening it on.

    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

  14. #14
    RC Champion shack351's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Kville
    Posts
    1,127
    Quote Originally Posted by spunkybob View Post
    Also.. my rear wheels were causing binding also.. they are proline trenchers on proline rims and if I did them up tight I was unable to spin them.

    So I added a Teflon washer between the hex and the rim (putting between the hex and the bearing did not work) and that added enough so they no longer bind.

    I have no idea why, and I have the MIP spacers in all the right locations.

    Maybe it's the RPM rear carriers flexing or compressing while tightening it on.

    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
    Hey Spunky,

    Next time you disassemble the rears, pull out part #10127 then reassemble and test it. It will only take a few minutes. I would be very curious as to your results. I know that the part should be there, whether plastic or aluminum carrier, but without it, mine works better. Since I have an extra set of aluminum stub axle carriers, I thought about slicing out a cross-section, assembling the pieces and then busting out the caliper and mic. With the ability to visually see what's going on inside, whatever is causing this cannot hide. There are other ways to do it without chopping up the nice part but it's only $10 bucks! Another project I'll add to my ever-growing RC Car "checklist" of things to-do.

    -Shack

  15. #15
    RC Qualifier spunkybob's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Posts
    605
    ill give it a go tonight.
    I don't see why you need that spacer anyway because there is a lip between the bearings to keep them spaced already.

    I am thinking my issues are due to the RPM parts. The stock traxxas plastic seems to be a closer tolerance and held the bearing better.

    I love my RPM arms, but thinking maybe not all RPM parts are necessary.

  16. #16
    RC Champion shack351's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Kville
    Posts
    1,127
    Quote Originally Posted by spunkybob View Post
    ill give it a go tonight.
    I don't see why you need that spacer anyway because there is a lip between the bearings to keep them spaced already.

    I am thinking my issues are due to the RPM parts. The stock traxxas plastic seems to be a closer tolerance and held the bearing better.

    I love my RPM arms, but thinking maybe not all RPM parts are necessary.
    I don't think your RPM arms are the problem. The only parts that could cause this are contained within the carrier/axle itself. Something that I did not mention earlier is that I am using aftermarket ceramic bearings instead of the stock ones. I need to go measure their height to see if there was any difference from stock. I will report back to you on that just to rule it out as factor.

    -Shack

  17. #17
    RC Qualifier MaxxBash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2016
    Posts
    635
    Quote Originally Posted by spunkybob View Post
    ill give it a go tonight.
    I don't see why you need that spacer anyway because there is a lip between the bearings to keep them spaced already.

    I am thinking my issues are due to the RPM parts. The stock traxxas plastic seems to be a closer tolerance and held the bearing better.

    I love my RPM arms, but thinking maybe not all RPM parts are necessary.
    According to mip's website they do not recommend using rpm arms when using their X-dutys.....I recently found that out thanks to other forum members and put new stock arms back on. No problems so far and it's been about two months. Rpm works really good in my 2wd slash but with my 4wd I can't have the arms so flexible. Just gotta be a little bit more careful


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  18. #18
    RC Champion MikeMcE's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Deep in the Everglades
    Posts
    1,291
    Trust me, you need the proper spacer to stop the bearings pulling inwards when tightening the locknut. The flex in the RPM arms is legendary and useless in the 4x4, but work perfect in the 2x2.


    Hang up and Drive
    HANG UP AND DRIVE!
    Slash 2wd 4x4
    PRO MT Yeti 4x4

  19. #19
    RC Qualifier
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Northern Norway
    Posts
    878
    Quote Originally Posted by spunkybob View Post
    Also.. my rear wheels were causing binding also.. they are proline trenchers on proline rims and if I did them up tight I was unable to spin them.

    So I added a Teflon washer between the hex and the rim (putting between the hex and the bearing did not work) and that added enough so they no longer bind.

    I have no idea why, and I have the MIP spacers in all the right locations.

    Maybe it's the RPM rear carriers flexing or compressing while tightening it on.

    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
    You are correct!
    The RPM rear hub carriers don't work well with the MIP X-Duty's (unless you do some shimming inbetween the bearings, which isn't easy to do). When you crank down the wheel nuts, the bearings are pinched because the spacer is too thin.
    My advice is to get rid of the RPM hub carriers and get the Traxxas alu carriers #1952X/A. (And if you interchange the alu carriers left to right, you can also reduce the rear toe-in to 1)

  20. #20
    RC Qualifier spunkybob's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Posts
    605
    When I got my sl4sh it came with an assortment of very crappy China special aluminium parts.

    Re installed the rears and it fixed the issue with binding.. car has never felt so smooth.

    Shame the bearing slots are about .05mm too big so I get a little wheel wobble but not noticeable any more then usual.

    Traxxas parts are extortion in Australia so I might grab the yeah racing front and rears... I have always been very happy with the yeah racing parts.



    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

  21. #21
    RC Champion shack351's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Kville
    Posts
    1,127
    Hey Spunky,

    As I said I would try to do, I have figured out the problem with both sets of my MIP X-Duty axles and since the problem can likely be found in other guys sets, here it is. I'll try to keep it short and sweet.

    The supposedly 2mm spacer (part # 10127) is in fact the culprit. All four of mine were 2.26mm! That is unacceptable for a precision-ground part such as this. Let me first say that the entire MIP rear assembly will install just fine. If you don't like a sloppy mess for your axle-to-carrier setup though, then this may help you.

    This is on a Slash 4x4 Platinum with aluminum carriers. I did not have any plastic ones to test or I would have... sorry.

    OK, we all see that MIP says the part should be 2mm.




    Here is what I tested. The picture almost tells it all. The top assembly is the original bearing type and the original-sized MIP spacer. The bottom is ceramics and the milled spacer. I removed .26mm from the spacer height to make it the correct 2mm size. Yes, the hexes were left off for this test. They are in the shop getting a 2nd grub installed 180 of the stock one.
    These 17mm extensions actually work better to demonstrate how you can now crank-down on the steel hub-retainer and have no binding or slop.








    Finally, here is a very quickly made video to help visualize the slop I removed form the assembly.

    https://youtu.be/k_72an-rqMI


    -Shack

  22. #22
    RC Champion MikeMcE's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Deep in the Everglades
    Posts
    1,291
    Have you sent this to MIP ?
    They seem to be reliable


    Hang up and Drive
    HANG UP AND DRIVE!
    Slash 2wd 4x4
    PRO MT Yeti 4x4

  23. #23
    RC Champion shack351's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Kville
    Posts
    1,127
    Hey Mike,

    No, I haven't. I just wrapped this up tonight. As you may or may not know, I am building a speed rig and this weekend I began disassembly of a brand-new Platinum. I have busted out the mic and caliper and I'm recording as many different specs as possible. While I do this, I am looking for any areas that need fine-tuning. I have found quite a few so far... more than I expected. I completely understand that this truck is not built to aerospace engineering standards and most likely few, if any, of its aftermarket parts are either! It is not built to do what I'm trying to do with it and it's about perfect for its intended use.

    The slop in the rear carriers was among three things that I worked on today. The servo-saver was re-engineered to remove some slop and the front Aluminum Castor & Steering Block mounting needed an overhaul. Having a machinist who is a perfectionist definitely helps here! I will be posting some of this when I start a new thread very shortly. I am trying to get my proverbial ducks-in-a-row before I spout off!

    -Shack

  24. #24
    RC Qualifier spunkybob's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Posts
    605
    Hi Shack, thanks for the detailed information.
    So by having the spacer slightly wider how is that causing the binding?

    Would it not just mean the bearings are just a little further apart? How does this affect it?

    Either way with the cheap aluminium parts I re installed the issue is now 100% gone and the truck is very smooth.

    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

  25. #25
    RC Champion olds97_lss's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Dekalb, IL
    Posts
    2,503
    The ones on my stampede bound even with the spacer. I had to add a couple metal shims to each of them, I think I use 5mm washers... didn't have enough shims. First tried using traxxas teflon washers, but they couldn't handle tightening down the wheel nut and the spacer/bearing basically just smashed them and squished them out like playdough. Then I dug through my stuff to find the 5mm ID washers/shims. If I remember right, the fronts worked fine with the included spacers and those have RPM carriers. The rear still has stock on one side and RPM on the other... I busted an RPM. The RPM side required an extra washer over the stock side or the bearings got crushed when tightening down the wheel nut.
    Expert rigging at it's best!

  26. #26
    RC Champion shack351's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Kville
    Posts
    1,127
    Quote Originally Posted by spunkybob View Post
    Hi Shack, thanks for the detailed information.
    So by having the spacer slightly wider how is that causing the binding?

    Would it not just mean the bearings are just a little further apart? How does this affect it?

    Either way with the cheap aluminium parts I re installed the issue is now 100% gone and the truck is very smooth.

    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
    Hi Spunky,

    Sorry, I don't think I was clear on that. With the installation of the rear X-Duty axles, there was 2 choices for me. Use the supplied spacer and live with all the excess play in both front wheels or leave them off to reduce the play but have to be very careful about how tight you get the hexes on. When I did not have the spacer installed and I would crank down even just a little on my 12-to-17mm adapters, they would start to bind as the bearings were stressed in ways they should not be. This meant using a bunch of Loctite to hold the adapter retaining nut at a point where it was just barely snug. Not the best solution. So, as mentioned above, I proceeded to look for the cause and that is what I found. I have done this mod to both my MIP X-Duty sets and they both are very tight now.

    -Shack

  27. #27
    RC Qualifier spunkybob's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Posts
    605
    Gotcha :-)

    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

  28. #28
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. El Sob's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Indianapolis
    Posts
    14,241
    It's funny that you are talking about the spacer. I recently had problems with the spacer. I couldn't get the wheel tight without it binding. I went through my spare parts and found another spacer that worked better. I never thought to see if the thickness was off.
    Member of the 10,000 + posts club! Here to help!

  29. #29
    RC Champion shack351's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Kville
    Posts
    1,127
    Quote Originally Posted by El Sob View Post
    It's funny that you are talking about the spacer. I recently had problems with the spacer. I couldn't get the wheel tight without it binding. I went through my spare parts and found another spacer that worked better. I never thought to see if the thickness was off.
    Yeah El Sob, I probably never would have either except for the fact that to get my Slash even close to record speeds, every last screw, nut or bolt had to be removed to "fix" those areas that are fine during our day-to-day bashing but don't do so well in 100+mph speed runs. All 4 of my # 10127 spacers (2 rear sets) were 2.25-26mm. I would be curious to know what size some of the other guys out there got with their kits. I have been busy with motor mods this weak but I am going to send my detailed findings with lots of pics and measurements to MIP and see what they say. Why not!?! If somebody has any spacer-specs they would like to be included in my note to them, post it and I'll include it. I know this is all splitting-hairs for some folks but my company releases several products a year and I know this one little oversight can be super-easily fixed. The rest of the axle kit components are top-notch. Whether they will own it and maybe offer a replacement spacer(s) is yet to be seen. You can bet I will post their reply here though!

    -Shack

  30. #30
    RC Turnbuckle Jr. El Sob's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Indianapolis
    Posts
    14,241
    Please Do! It's our job as consumers to let company's know about their products so they can make improvements as needed.

    Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk
    Member of the 10,000 + posts club! Here to help!

  31. #31
    RC Qualifier spunkybob's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Posts
    605
    Welline have been working really well now that I have the aluminium hubs in.

    I did lose a grub screw (shaft to tranny) and replacements are $29 in Australia or $10 and 4 weeks from America "sigh"

    Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

  32. #32
    RC poster
    Join Date
    Nov 2019
    Posts
    3
    Sorry for reviving this thread but i just installed some MIPS XDUTY CVD Rears #18140.

    I didnt end up using Part #10127 which is the spacer between the 2 bearings.

    Can someone explain to me why this is needed? I see there are grooves already in the carrier that keep them separated

    I upgraded my rear carriers to aluminum at the same time and i saw that the old carriers didnt use any washer either.

    Should i go back and install it or am i okay without it?

  33. #33
    RC Champion olds97_lss's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Dekalb, IL
    Posts
    2,503
    It's there as a bearing spacer to avoid the bearings being side loaded when you tighten down the wheel nut. I know I needed to mess with the spacing as when I cranked down the wheel nut, the slotted MIP hex/hub slid a little bit and caused it to bind the bearings from the side. With the axle disconnected from the cvd, I could rotate the wheel and it would feel slightly notchy because of it. This would cause the bearings to have a very short life.

    The shims/spacers they included didn't fit quite right and I think I ended up using one of them and shims or some other spacer to compensate. When done and the wheel nut cranked down, the shaft and bearings would move a very little bit in and out of the alloy hubs I used.
    Expert rigging at it's best!

  34. #34
    RC Qualifier spunkybob's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Posts
    605
    Funny thing is I revived my sl4sh the other day haha!

    The spacers are there as the above poster mentioned to ensure the bearings are not overtighten down causing the rotating centre bit to be "off centre" as the plastic can bend/warp.

    I use yeah racing aluminium hubs and it's also a perfect fit.

    Sent from my Phone 2 using Tapatalk

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •