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  1. #81
    RC Champion RazorRC22's Avatar
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    Nice work! If you're looking for even better handling, I recommend trying a new body. I found the Traxxas Slash body to not be as planted as Pro-line and it will also obviously fly better with a cutout body. I'm not sure if it's the shape of the Traxxas body or the weight, but my Slashes were more stable and had more traction with aftermarket bodies.
    youtube.com/c/RazorRCvideos

  2. #82
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    How to modify slash 4x4 gtr front shock for more droop.

    Stock GTR shocks on front have about 10mm less droop than in rear and thats too little droop and makes steering twitchy when driven in limit on track and also on-power steering is not that constant. Also jumping is not that good.

    Just finished modifying my front shock like this:
    -2 x xo-1 gtr front shock bodies 5466X https://traxxas.com/products/parts/5466X (3mm inside longer than slash 4x4 gtr shock bodies)

    -2 x Team Losi Racing 3.5x48mm TiCN Front Shock Shaft (from Losi 22SCT and 1mm longer than gtr shock shafts but piston attachment point is much better and higher on shaft) https://www.amainhobbies.com/team-lo...233001/p265889

    -1 x Traxxas 5461 Variable Damping Kit GTR pistons which you can drill holes you need i use 4 x 1.3mm and you have to drill center hole to 3mm (stock is 2.5mm)
    https://traxxas.com/products/parts/5461

    -1 x Losi TLR6105 3mm Shaft E-Clip Set (this locks pistons to new losi sct shock shafts)
    https://www.amainhobbies.com/team-lo...lr6105/p193893

    Whith stock front gtr shocks you have 87mm length from top to bottom eye on shock. With these modded gtrs shock you have 93mm which is maximum droop allowed of the body and driveshafts.

    You have to but 3mm limiters inside shock pistons to get that 93mm droop but without those you can get 97mm droop on different shock position.

    This means you have good droop now in front also and much better handling now.


  3. #83
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    My Slash 4x4 Platinum setup from front to rear.

    Front Diff 10k
    Center Diff 10k
    Rear Diff 5k

    Front Shocks - GTR(long)
    TLR black - short
    45w
    1.5cm of preload
    top middle hole
    lower 3rd from inner

    Rear Shocks - GTR(xxl)
    TLR green - long
    40w
    1.2cm of preload
    Top middle hole
    Lower 2nd from inner

    Rear black sway bar(always on the truck)
    Front silver sway bar or no sway bar depending on track conditions(loose = add bar / tight = remove bar)

    Motor - 4.5T 550 size sensored
    ESC - 150a sensored
    Servo - Savox 1257
    Gears - 15/54
    Traxxas aluminum motor mount
    Traxxas aluminum finned motor heatsink(no fan)

    RPM lower chassis plate
    HR upper chassis brace
    Trimmed front and rear bumpers
    Jconcepts Manta body
    Jconcepts Rulux wheels
    Jconcepts Bar codes(super soft/green or soft/blue)
    or
    Jconcepts Pressure Points(super soft/green)

    This works great on a blue groove, smooth and very technical track. Average times for 2wd/4wd buggy is low 18's and this truck is consistently in the low 20's high 19's average lap time with traffic.

    Since we dont have a ton of huge jumps(just one triple) the front long GTR shocks work for me. If they redesign the track to where it has larger jumps ill have to look into adding more downtravel up front.
    6 Traxxas vehicles and counting...

  4. #84
    RC Champion RazorRC22's Avatar
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    #13 Mid-corner

    Now your truck has entered the corner, you're approaching the apex and going around it. The main thing you're looking for is that you still have additional steering if needed, and that your truck smoothly and cleanly goes through the corner. Personally I like even traction front to back, so that one end doesn't let go suddenly while you still have tons of traction with the other end. You don't want a truck that suddenly loses the rear end as you are at the apex or pushes badly as you are trying to round the corner.

    Your driving style can depend, but most likely you will be at neutral throttle as you go through the corner and then start accelerating at the apex as you exit the corner.

    Body roll
    A common misconception is that body roll is bad. It's not -- you need roll to generate traction. Too much is bad as you will overload the outside tires, and too little is bad, because your truck will slide rather than roll. So you have to find that sweet spot where it rolls enough to generate traction, but not so much that it overloads the tires. While the truck is rolling, it is not really changing direction and you spend a lot of time waiting for the body mass to roll back and forth. So I usually try to aim for the minimum amount of roll necessary to get the traction I need to get through the corner. Any more is just wasted motion. For high traction tracks, you already have a lot of traction, so you will want less body for a more responsive truck and to avoid too much traction (traction rolling). For loose conditions you will need more body roll to generate traction. So how do we adjust the amount of body roll?

    Camber links
    A lot of people try to control roll through springs, but you already have the springs set up properly for your truck, so let's use that other lesser known adjustment -- shock tower camber link location.

    - A lower location on the shock tower will raise the roll center and make it roll less.
    - A higher location on the shock tower will lower the roll center and make it roll more.

    Play with these locations and see if you can tell the difference between an upper location and lower location. You should notice a significant difference in roll and traction on the end you change. For most scenarios, I think you can stick with the lower camber link location on the Slash 4x4.

    A stock Slash does not have camber link location adjustments on the hub/caster blocks, but some aftermarket parts provide this. This has the same effect as the shock tower location, but opposite.

    - Higher on the hubs will raise the roll center and make it roll less.
    - Lower on the hubs will lower the roll center and make it roll more.

    Anti-roll bars
    The last main adjustment you will use is anti-roll bars. I try to avoid using these unless I simply can't get the right amount of roll using the camber link locations alone. What anti-roll bars do are connect the left and right arms together, so that when you compress the outside arm, the inside arm has to compress also. These have a bigger impact in high speed corners. They do reduce roll, but at the expense of less independent suspension. For the most part, you will use anti-roll bars for smooth tracks. Bumpy tracks with less independent suspension will cause the truck to get knocked around more even just driving in a straight line.

    So if your truck is pushing in the corners (overwhelming the front), try lowering the roll center in the front or raising it in the rear. If your truck is oversteering mid-corner if you add even just a little bit of throttle, try lowering the roll center in the rear or raising it in the front to get it balanced. If those don't work, I would try swaybars. For dirt, I think you can usually use no swaybar in the front and silver in the rear. For super high traction (carpet or astroturf) or high speed tracks, you may want to try silver in the front and black in the rear.
    Last edited by RazorRC22; 07-23-2018 at 11:57 PM.
    youtube.com/c/RazorRCvideos

  5. #85
    RC Racer
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    Great job! These trucks are awesome! I'm getting my son's truck dialed in. I bought a used ultimate, that's next.

  6. #86
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    This is a great thread! Thanks for your commitment. Subbed you on Youtube also.
    X-Maxx 8s / Slash 4x4 / Rustler 4x4 VXL

  7. #87
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    What motor mount/center diff, front bearing holder do you use and what drive shaft?
    X-Maxx 8s / Slash 4x4 / Rustler 4x4 VXL

  8. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by NitroStarGT View Post
    This is a great thread! Thanks for your commitment. Subbed you on Youtube also.
    It is a great thread! Did you sub to me or Razor? He’s great in my opinion. As for me, I need to get off my butt and edit a ton of my crazy RC video footage. If hurricane Florence permits, maybe I will... I am praying for Beach RC in Myrtle Beach SC right now.

    As for a good SCT body for racing, I recommend the Pro-Line Flo-Tek EvoSC body.
    $+RC+more$+friends+more$=FUN!
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  9. #89
    RC Champion RazorRC22's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NitroStarGT View Post
    What motor mount/center diff, front bearing holder do you use and what drive shaft?
    I've since sold my Slash 4x4, but used to run King Headz, traxxas center diff, traxxas alum bearing holder and driveshaft.
    youtube.com/c/RazorRCvideos

  10. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by EvHexRC View Post

    As for a good SCT body for racing, I recommend the Pro-Line Flo-Tek EvoSC body.
    I second this!

    Sent from my VS985 4G using Tapatalk

  11. #91
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    Razor I still love this thread. This is very informative and I keep learning each time I come back. With your help I have been able to get more fun out of my track days. My truck handles corners well on carpet. It will roll upon entry if I am carrying too much speed. I have also noticed it lifting the inside front tire, but it does not understeer mid corner or at exit.

    I think I still have too soft of springs on my slash with a 1/8 scale system. It smacks the chassis hard with jumps. Sometimes the just the front on landing and sometimes it bucks the rear end at the top of the jump.

    I am currently running standard GTR front shocks on the front, and I am looking into changing to GTR rears or lengthening them as Vulvo mentioned.

    In your drop test you don't have a body on. Is this just for illustrative purposes? I figured doing this in race ready condition (body on battery in) would give more accurate results. Or does this not matter in your experience?

  12. #92
    RC Champion RazorRC22's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aliensrgr8 View Post
    Razor I still love this thread. This is very informative and I keep learning each time I come back. With your help I have been able to get more fun out of my track days. My truck handles corners well on carpet. It will roll upon entry if I am carrying too much speed. I have also noticed it lifting the inside front tire, but it does not understeer mid corner or at exit.
    Nice! Glad to hear the truck is working good. I would try swaybars front and rear if you haven't already. Try silver front and black rear. On carpet, everything needs to be stiffer in general.

    I think I still have too soft of springs on my slash with a 1/8 scale system. It smacks the chassis hard with jumps. Sometimes the just the front on landing and sometimes it bucks the rear end at the top of the jump.
    Definitely run the blue GTR springs if you want to stick with Traxxas springs. Else you can try the TEN-SCTE springs if you convert to rear shocks up front.

    In your drop test you don't have a body on. Is this just for illustrative purposes? I figured doing this in race ready condition (body on battery in) would give more accurate results. Or does this not matter in your experience?
    I don't like to take the body on and off when I'm tuning on the bench, so I just test everything with body off (including ride height measurements, etc.). I think most people do just for convenience. To be super accurate, yes, putting the body on when measuring is correct, but most people don't bother.
    youtube.com/c/RazorRCvideos

  13. #93
    RC Champion RazorRC22's Avatar
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    #14 Corner Exit

    I'll be honest here, I don't usually spend much time tuning for corner exit. Not sure why, but in most cases your Slash 4x4 should have plenty of corner exit traction and accelerate well. When exiting the corner, you're going to be applying the throttle aggressively and want the truck to accelerate hard and still steer.

    Some things to solve would be understeering, oversteering, and possibly wheelieing.

    Understeer:

    If the truck is understeering, this means you have very good rear traction, but the front wheels are unloading and not maintaining enough contact with the ground to help you steer. You can take away rear traction to solve this, but I think a better solution is try to maintain more front wheel traction.

    Some things to look at are if you have too much front droop. This is not a problem if you're running stock length front shocks (either Ultrashocks or GTR front shocks), as they actually don't have enough front droop. Of your shocks may be mounted too far in on the front arms which also will allow them to extend more. When the front shocks can extend pretty far, this means your truck allows a LOT of weight transfer to the rear under acceleration and is unloading the front tires.

    Your rear springs could also be too soft and allowing the truck to squat too much (and unload the front tires).

    Oversteer:

    If the truck is oversteering exiting the corner, this usually means the rear end does not have enough traction and is sliding out when you are applying the throttle. Some potential causes are too stiff of rear springs, or too much rear camber gain.

    With short rear camber links, the rear wheels will camber in dramatically when the rear end squats, and end up tilting in with a poor contact patch. Only the inside edges of the tires will be touching the ground.

    You can also add rear toe-in which will cause the rear end to lock-in more. With the stock plastic rear hubs, you will have 2.5 degrees of rear toe-in which should be pretty good, but I think there are other options out there that can add additional toe-in. Something in the 2.5-3 degree range should be good, possibly more on really loose outdoor tracks. I don't like to go much higher than 3 degrees as this will also cause the truck to push on corner entry and mid-corner as the truck is constantly trying to go straight rather than corner.

    Wheelieing

    The last thing you may have problems with (especially on high traction or with a lot of power) is wheelieing. If you're running really thick center diff fluid, the truck will accelerate hard, but could wheelie over bumps down the front straight. Running thinner fluid will allow some of the power to bleed off to the front tires when they become unloaded and reduce the wheelieing effect. You shouldn't need to go under 50k IMO, I prefer to keep the 4WD effect and run thicker center diff fluids in general.

    While wheelieing looks cool, it's not very effective for driving fast, so you want to avoid this.
    youtube.com/c/RazorRCvideos

  14. #94
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    Me again!
    Thought I'd report back.
    We've have some snow sorta fall from the sky lately, but it's not staying, yet, and that means the end of our outdoor rc season here in Northern Ontario Canada.

    Thought I'd continue my story from post #65:

    So it was an extremely hot summer for us! After I fried my motor, replaced it and installed the fans, I cut my practice runs on the track to 6 min. max. and took about a 30 min. break between runs: this helped.

    Like I said earlier, I'm a beginner racer. So I would start each practice on the driver's stand then once my Slash needed rescue, I'd come down, put it rubber side down, then stay on the track for the rest of the time.
    It's funny, I began staying on the driver's stand full-time right after I installed aluminium carriers, on the correct side, so giving me 4 deg. toe-in by default; either this helped big-time! Or I improved as a driver! Let's say both!

    A veteran racer suggested that I convert any plastic that is touching a bearing to aluminium, so I did! So far so good!

    I also replaced the front and rear plastic drive shafts with the steel Traxxas ones; again, so far so good. The connection pins of the plastic ones were wearing out the plastic holes, to the point where one was on the brink of shearing off. Glad I caught it in time!

    I fried two VXL-3s ECS's this summer! Is that normal? The first time it happened at a race: I broke the plastic servo horn 3 times! I borrowed one after the third time, fixed it, then had no wheel movement! Doh! The second time was while practicing: our track was semi dry but the mud caked on thick! It was ok on the first run but it built-up so think on the second run that the Slash weighed about 3 lbs. more! I noticed it was struggling so I stopped. After a thorough cleaning, it now stutters when I pull the trigger. I Googled this and most verdicts is faulty ESC. I'm switching to A Hobbywing ESC...

    Oh yeah, I switched to an aluminium servo horn and never had steering problems!

    I was second twice in the B final in our races then won it at our last competition! However, I completely screwed up twice on the first lap of the A final plus, I shredded the spur gear with 1 min. to go! The Slash made a funny noise as I lined up for the final. I heard the same noise in practice and had time to stop and correct then; not this time. Since installing the ST RC aluminium motor mount, tiny pebbles find their way in there. Both times a rock was jammed in the pinion!

    So as you can see, with many mods, the Slash can be competitive! I was going to get a Tekno SCT410.3 for the indoor season but folks tell me that the Slash is great indoors. Does anyone have any great tips for small gymnasium track racing?
    JES

  15. #95
    RC Qualifier NOFTCHX's Avatar
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    Amazing thread keep it going.

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    "Theres not bad people, just bad choices."

  16. #96
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    I too hope this thread continues. As a rank beginner my driving is improving to where Id like to make my Rustler 4x4 VXL handle better. This has been a great start to understanding the various adjustments. Im assuming that they will apply to the Rustler as well as the Slash.

  17. #97
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    +1 on the great thread comments, and thank you so much for sharing your knowledge and experience.

  18. #98
    RC Champion RazorRC22's Avatar
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    It's been 6 months, guess it's time to do another installment in the tuning guide. I forgot what the plan was to talk about next, so I guess we'll discuss jumping and landing.

    #15 Jumping and Landing

    Not a whole lot to say about jumping and landing, except to talk about shock pack. Your shocks will react differently under slower, small movement in the shocks (driving over a rough patch down the straightaway, the truck rolling from straight up and down to the side in the corners) and fast, large movements such as landing a jump from 2 feet off the ground.

    In general, tracks should be set up with launching ramps AND landing ramps. If you're driving on a track with just a launch ramp and they expect you to drop out of the sky 5 feet and land nicely, well, that's just a poorly designed track.

    Pistons and shock oil

    In any case, you are going to try to set up your truck so that it handles the slow, small movements well, while also handling the big, fast movements. This is controlled by the shock oil, and the pistons. You can get the shock to react similarly in the small bumps by using thick shock oil and large piston holes, and using thing, small piston holes. But while they may behave the same in the small stuff, they will react quite differently in the big jumps.

    Traxxas GTR shocks use 2x1.5mm holes up front and 2x1.6mm holes in the rear. I found switching to 1.5mm holes in the rear reduced packed more quickly when landing jumps and reduced the amount of chassis slap. The LCG chassis on the Slash is very low to the ground, too low really, and you will need to deal with chassis slap. When switching to 1.5mm hole pistons in the rear, I also reduced the shock oil by 2.5-5wt to keep the same behavior on the bumps.

    Nose-dive

    Another common problem people encounter is the truck nose-diving in the air. This is usually caused by the tail slapping on the face of the jump, and then causing it to rebound and kick up the tail in the air. Adding ride height (so that you have more room for the rear end to compress on the launch ramp) or adding more shock pack or stiffer springs in the rear will help with this problem.

    Aerodynamics

    Really the worst handling attribute of short course trucks is how they fly through the air. You definitely need to use a body with a lot of cutouts to reduce the parachute effect! I also found that bodies with fins such as the Proline Fusion body helps to stabilize the truck in the air and keep it flying straight. Don't underestimate how big a difference bodies make!
    youtube.com/c/RazorRCvideos

  19. #99
    RC Qualifier NOFTCHX's Avatar
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    A big thanks to RazorRC22. Im glad I came across this. Even more stoked that this thread is brought back after so long. All the info on here should be in a hand book in everyone's rc collection.

    Quote Originally Posted by Heli_av8tor View Post
    I too hope this thread continues. As a rank beginner my driving is improving to where Id like to make my Rustler 4x4 VXL handle better. This has been a great start to understanding the various adjustments. Im assuming that they will apply to the Rustler as well as the Slash.
    Yea all the info on this thread will apply to any rc vehicle. Especially the slash 4x4 stampede 4x4 and Rustler 4x4. The new slash 4x4 ultimate is built almost like the new 4x4 Rustler. They have the same front and rear a-arms and heavy duty driveshaft and servo. All three of those models are basically built off the same chassis. I have 2 p4des and 2 sl4shes. I can Switch out my p4de chassis with the slash chassis. I just need a longer center drive shaft. Id personally consider stampede/slash/Rustler 4x4s all pretty much the same except the body and a bit longer.
    Last edited by cooleocool; 03-27-2019 at 06:46 PM. Reason: merge
    "Theres not bad people, just bad choices."

  20. #100
    RC Champion RazorRC22's Avatar
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    Well, it's been fun guys, I've decided to leave this forum as I don't really run Traxxas kits anymore and I don't see myself getting another Traxxas for awhile.

    If they come out with something worth my money, I'll be back, but even their "redesigns" like the Rustler 4x4 have been pretty lackluster IMO. Good luck all.
    youtube.com/c/RazorRCvideos

  21. #101
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    Thanks for this superb thread RazorRC22!! Really helped to tune my truck.

  22. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by RazorRC22 View Post
    Well, it's been fun guys, I've decided to leave this forum as I don't really run Traxxas kits anymore and I don't see myself getting another Traxxas for awhile.

    If they come out with something worth my money, I'll be back, but even their "redesigns" like the Rustler 4x4 have been pretty lackluster IMO. Good luck all.
    Right there, with ya. This was fun trying to set my traxxas's up to race, but plain annoying and frustrating when I realized they're just not meant to be on a racetrack. I will be picking up a stock slash 2wd or two at some point to race in the "stock slash" spec classes at some of the tracks I race at. Way below my level, but everyone races it because it's a super cheap class to have on the side of the others we all race. I personally think the "stock slash" class is really great for RC because it can get so many more people into racing with less $$$. The 17.5 2wd buggy class was supposed to be that, but look at what it is now...

    -Ev
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  23. #103
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    I keep trying to get my local track to do a spec Slash class to get more people interested in racing on the cheap. They won't do it. 2wd stock buggy has become more expensive than mod it seems like.

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  24. #104
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    Scc8

    Quote Originally Posted by VulvoS40T4 View Post
    Hellou from Finland!

    Like to share my setup also which is made for SSC8 LCG chassis Slash 4x4 but works also with stock LCG chassis.

    I have GTR front and rear shocks and normal aluminium shock towers front and rear. I have fine tuned this setup now half year and its very good base setup for all surfaces and tracks. My truck has HW Xerun 4300kv motor and XR8SCT ESC + Sanwa MT44 controller + Highest DLP750 servo.

    Many drivers here have liked this setup which goal was to make Slash 4x4 fastest Short course truck on race track.







    I want to copy your setup. I'm using losi sct ten front and rear shocks though. Should I run your specified traxxas springs? Will they fit?
    I'm using tekno center shaft. What are you running for axles/wheels/tires? 17mm conversion?
    Are stock towers ok to mimic your setup?
    I've got a little time and money in this thing already and just cant get it to work so when I saw you post a setup with the same chassis I got excited.
    BTW, just live a mile down the street from SSC owner in Florida...
    I'm tempted just to buy a new set of gtr shocks...

  25. #105
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    Subscribed!

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  26. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by RazorRC22 View Post
    Well, it's been fun guys, I've decided to leave this forum as I don't really run Traxxas kits anymore and I don't see myself getting another Traxxas for awhile.

    If they come out with something worth my money, I'll be back, but even their "redesigns" like the Rustler 4x4 have been pretty lackluster IMO. Good luck all.
    Hey RazorRC22, not sure if you still return to this thread, its old now, but just in case, many thanks for taking the time and effort to share. Your dialogue is well written, easy to follow, and as relevant now as it was when it was posted. Your efforts have saved me many weeks of effort and experimentation which is awesome. The information given is all good.
    I started a couple of weeks ago with a Traxxas Slash 4x4 which worked ok out of the box, but was never going to win hearts and minds at the local off road track. Its best features were intense body slams and high speed cartwheels. That was ok, the core chassis and running gear is strong had good potential, but it sure needed some work to get it to stay on the track and behave in corners and while airborne. After many happy hours of intensive tweaks and rearranging of suspension, it is now a delight to drive and a good stable performer at speed. Most of the changes made are based on the guidance provided in your notes.
    So, thank you once again and I hope whatever you moved on to worked well for you.

  27. #107
    RC Champion RazorRC22's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by petemate View Post
    Hey RazorRC22, not sure if you still return to this thread, its old now, but just in case, many thanks for taking the time and effort to share. Your dialogue is well written, easy to follow, and as relevant now as it was when it was posted. Your efforts have saved me many weeks of effort and experimentation which is awesome. The information given is all good.
    I started a couple of weeks ago with a Traxxas Slash 4x4 which worked ok out of the box, but was never going to win hearts and minds at the local off road track. Its best features were intense body slams and high speed cartwheels. That was ok, the core chassis and running gear is strong had good potential, but it sure needed some work to get it to stay on the track and behave in corners and while airborne. After many happy hours of intensive tweaks and rearranging of suspension, it is now a delight to drive and a good stable performer at speed. Most of the changes made are based on the guidance provided in your notes.
    So, thank you once again and I hope whatever you moved on to worked well for you.
    Thanks, glad to hear your truck is working well! I just bought a Maxx so check in here on occasion.
    youtube.com/c/RazorRCvideos

  28. #108
    RC Qualifier NitroBugg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RazorRC22 View Post
    Thanks, glad to hear your truck is working well! I just bought a Maxx so check in here on occasion.
    5 Month break...so...you're back?

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