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  1. #1
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    1/10th Ford fiesta rally wheel and tire upgrade?

    Hello everyone I am very new to this forum as well as the rc world. I recently picked up the Ford fiesta rally car and have been driving it around my apartment complex bone stock and giggling like a little girl. I bought this car because I love Ken Block and the gymkhana style of driving but so far I havent been able to get this thing to do doughnuts on anything but loose dirt. So I have a couple questions if I may.
    #1 What upgrades should I look into to drive it in more of the gymkhana style? Ie drifting, small jumps, stuff of that nature.
    #2 To look more the gymkhana style is it possible to get different body styles?
    #3 What size/type of tires should I look at?
    #4 What size/style rims will fit on this car? It says 1/10 but next to my hpi hoonicorn the Ford fiesta rally is a monster truck.
    Thanks in advance for any help, and please keep in mind I am very new to this hobby (Christmas 2018), and while I love to look at cars I'm not very good with terminology.

  2. #2
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    Get some 4 inch pvc pipe and cut it into rings about 2 inches wide. These will fit over the tires and give better drifts when they are on. I’m unaware of any commercially produced drift tires that are big enough for the 1/10 rally so you have to improvise. Stiffening the rear diff with very heavy diff fluid (1 million) will make it easier to drift with the stock tires. Converting to a brushless system will greatly increase speed and ability to break the tires loose. Going to 3s and brushless will take this idea to the extreme but will stress the drivetrain, putting you on an expensive upgrade path (one that many here are on).

    When shopping for bodies look for ones that fit the slash. Unfortunately I’m not aware of any 240sx or similar bodies out there.

    Remember the 1/10 rally is really a slash 4x4 with slightly narrower arms and different bumpers and body mounts so check out the slash 4x4 forum too. Most of what is said there applies directly to the rally.

  3. #3
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    Awesome thank you so much for the help. Now I read somewhere, may have been the manual for all I remember but it said that 3s was more for speed runs and 2s is more appropriate for I guess the term would be bashing? Is that not completely true or is that why you said it becomes an expensive upgrade path?

  4. #4
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    The upgrade path

    The rally is a slash 4x4 underneath. A 1/10 4x4 SCT is very heavy for a 1/10 RC model. Before the popularity of Short Course trucks, the typical 1/10 model was quite lightweight. The weight of a 4x4 Slash/Rally is close to that of a 1/8 scale model. That makes it hard work for a motor to push it around.

    Once you go brushless, you can get a high kv 2S motor, which most people use for racing 4x4 models because the rules specify a 2S battery. Power(work performed per second, measured in watts) = Volts x Amps. So to do a lot of work (make a heavy model go fast) at a given voltage, you need more current (amps). So on 2S, heavy models pull a lot of amps, which is hard on ESCs and batteries and generates a lot of heat, which kills motors.

    So for non-racing applications, many bashers select a lower kv motor (kv for a brushless motor represents the number of motor revolutions per volt applied) and run a 3S pack. The higher voltage of the 3S pack allows them to get the same number of motor revolutions per second at a lower current draw. The construction of the motor, particularly the longer can that is against racing rules, allows for more torque, which enables a 3S user to gear a little taller for more top speed at a given number of motor revolutions per second.

    That is all fine, within reason. However, this is a hobby, and we as participants in the hobby do not always behave within reason. After all, if an aggressive current draw was OK on 2S, why not have that same aggressive current draw on 3S? On 3S, with that same amount of current, I can spin a motor super fast. And now I also have more torque, so I can geared taller.

    So now my truck runs faster than greased owl mess. Until I hit something. Then I need new castor blocks. Might as well get aluminum ones. The new aluminum blocks are strong.

    So strong that the next time I hit something, I break a suspension arm instead. RPM makes upgraded ones in cool colors that match my truck's current body, so that's worth spending a few dollars over stock replacement parts.

    Next time out that big honkin' motor and those 3S batteries I bought deliver so much torque I twisted a driveshaft. Now I need the $70 MPI ones instead of the $4 plastic ones.

    And at 50+ MPH my tires are ballooning so much they rub the body, so instead of a new set of stock tires, I need expensive ones.

    Except those don't work on my stock wheels, so I need expensive wheels.

    But my new expensive wheels have 17mm hexes, so I need to upgrade the hex drives on my truck. And look, they make those in aluminum in a cool color that will coordinate with the paint job I always wanted. So now in order to justify spending $50 on blinging hex drives that will be invisible once I have wheels on my truck I need to spend $50 on a new body plus $40 on paint and stickers plus take a vacation day to paint so that springing for blingy wheel hexes will not have been silly.

    But those RPM arms in the cool color that matched my old body don't match my new body. Now I need new arms again.

    Had an awesome bash session with the new wheels, body, and arms. But now the transmission in my truck is running so fast my transmission case is melting. So I need a new, aluminum transmission case. Might as well buy the best and be done with it, right?

    All this new, stronger stuff is heavier than my stock stuff, so my truck handles like a pile of excrement. Now I need new, bigger shocks with stiffer springs. But I don't know exactly what spring rate to get, so I have to buy 4 sets to see which ones I like. The ones I like don't really jive with the shock oil I have, so I need some different weights of shock oil to experiment with.

    Once the suspension is tuned, my vehicle is blistering fast, leaving the earlier owl mess in its dust. But I don't know how fast, so I go buy a Garmin so I can post photos of my top speed on the Traxxas forum.

    Now that I'm an online celebrity, I'm getting invitations to drive and bash with other people. Their radios have screens. I didn't even realize rc radios needed screens, but everyone else has one. I need a new radio. Dang, radios are expensive.

    Everyone digs my new radio. BUT, they say, that stock steering servo is too slow. And does not have enough torque. So I need a new steering servo, and not just any steering servo, but a good one. Wait, a good one costs what? Wow. At least for that money I'm getting titanium gears.

    By this point I'm noticing that the body I bought to match my wheel hexes is not all that aerodynamic, so i need an expensive kit to attach a speed run body so i can get a couple more mph for my online photos. But jumping my truck is fun, too, so I promptly ruin the speed run conversion kit and body by taking the truck to the skatepark before I ever even do a speed run.

    It goes on from here.

    Brent
    Last edited by BMcD308; 03-08-2019 at 01:56 PM. Reason: spelling

  5. #5
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    BTW, I don't think it is completely true that 3S is for speed runs and 2S is for bashing. An aggressive 2S setup can be just as fast as a conservative 3S setup.

    The expensive upgrade path begins when you use the move to 3S to justify having a truck that is 2x as fast as the truck might have been on 2S. Also, many ESCs that will comfortably handle 3S will also handle 4S, and you have those 2S packs laying around that could be wired in series...

    If you go to brushless and 3S, you are not obligated to pick a 4000kv motor with a burst draw in excess of 150 amps, although some do. There are plenty of people on here with 3S vehicles that are only a little bit faster than a dialed in 2S setup. The big difference is the 2S setup is on the ragged edge, but the 3S setup can run at cool, comfy temperatures with amp draws that make for long motor, ESC and battery life.

    Everything in this hobby is expensive. Things get real expensive when you get aggressive. 3S or even 4S is not necessarily aggressive by itself. Your model was designed by Traxxas with certain operating parameters in mind. 3S and 4S (and more S, for that matter) systems provide the opportunity to operate well outside those parameters, IF that is what you choose to do. Your Traxxas vehicle is an awesome piece of engineering. But if you put an elevator motor in it, you're going to need to upgrade pretty much every part on it.

  6. #6
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    Bmcd308 I see what your saying, however with a 19 month old and another on the way I find it hard to go down that path, at least not without dragging it out over 10 years. However I've been saving up amazon gift cards over the last couple years, so I did by the venellion system the tqi radio the slipper clutch the blue rod that runs down the center of my car a roll cage from yea racing and a motor mount and fan for the esu. I currently have 2 traxxas 2c 7400 batteries, again I only have time for 45 min bashing sessions once my wife and child go to bed. Is it possible with those upgrades to drift and do small level stunts? Or have I already started down the rabbit hole?

  7. #7
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    You are not. The Velineon system is within the operating parameters of the vehicle. It has a sensible but powerful motor and supports 3s max, so your damage is likely to be crash damage rather than from over stressing the driveline. Those batteries will provide plenty of current to break the tires loose, particularly if you do the “temporary” drift tire mod of wrapping them in electric tape.

    Have fun!

  8. #8
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    Okay so quick question for you I bought the slipper clutch, and installed it and the venellion system but now I am having a problem getting them to mesh, are they not compatible or am I just missing something?

  9. #9
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    Also any advice on figuring out or simplifying the gear and teth and pitch. I'm looking for torque and grip opposed to speed. Noobie in need of help.

  10. #10
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    By getting them to mesh, do you mean getting the spur and pinion to mesh?

    Do the teeth seem like they are a different size, or are you just having trouble getting them the correct distance apart? If you are having trouble getting them to be the correct distance apart, see this:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3WPTtcOZ2N8

    Traxxas video on gear mesh.

    Stock gearing on a 4x4 Slash VXL is 13/54. The Rally wheels are almost exactly the same diameter as the Slash SC tires, so that gearing should work well.

    If the problem is that the pinion and spur seem to have different size teeth and therefore will not mesh, then you have a pitch problem. I don't have the same car as you, because my son's rally started out as a 4x4 Slash and then got converted. But the Slash 4x4 comes with 32p (almost exactly the same as mod .8, which is metric 32p) gears, and I assume that your Rally would, too.

    Slash 4x4 comes with a 13 tooth module 0.8 spur gear (for some reason pretty much all spur gears are sold in the metric size, but again, mod .8 and 32p are close enough that it doesn't matter) and a 54 tooth 32p pinion gear.

    Pitch refers to how many teeth will fit around a 1 inch circle. So 32p gears have bigger teeth (fewer around a 1 inch circle) than 48p gears. It is possible (but I simply don't know) that your rally came with 48p gears (some Traxxas vehicles are 32p, some are 48p) and that is why you are having a problem.

    A smaller spur or larger pinion will tend to reduce top speed and motor temps and provide the sensation of more torque.

    A larger spur or smaller pinion will tend to increase top speed and motor temps and provide the sensation of less torque.

  11. #11
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    wow, some of you guys really make this whole upgrade sound extremely complicated.

    i, on the other hand, just chucked in a vxl motor/esc combo from a brushless 2wd slash i had sitting around along with a 3s battery. i've been bashing/drifting it all over the place for the last few months as-is with zero issues besides worn tires. guess i'll have to tell my car it shouldn't be running so great when i take it out again tomorrow.

  12. #12
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    Which is the pinion and which is spur? I'm honestly not sure if I'm having trouble lineing them up or if it's a difference in size. I havent seen that video but the ones I've seen a few videos and it shows both of the gears being easily accessible but on the Ford fiesta rally they are rather difficult to get to. P.S. sorry for the rather dumb question

  13. #13
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    The pinion is the metal one that is on the motor's shaft, and the spur is the other one. In that video, it was easy to get to the gears because it was a 2wd slash. Do you have pictures of what your gears look like?
    I like free stuff!

  14. #14
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    I can post pics later today/tonight

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by BMcD308 View Post
    A smaller spur or larger pinion will tend to reduce top speed and motor temps and provide the sensation of more torque.

    A larger spur or smaller pinion will tend to increase top speed and motor temps and provide the sensation of less torque.
    I just checked back in on this thread and realized the above is backwards. Sorry. I posted without being careful enough.

    A larger spur (the big one) or a smaller pinion (the little one on the motor) will tend to reduce top speed and motor temps and will provide the sensation of more torque. A larger spur or smaller pinion will cause the transmission to rotate less for each rotation of the motor.

    Again, sorry.

  16. #16
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    1/10th Ford fiesta rally wheel and tire upgrade

    PRICE REDUCED - 24,000

    Couldnt find a way to edit the post. Let me know if ther is an way, thanks. Daniel

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