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  1. #1
    RC Champion grizzly03's Avatar
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    Cool Jato off road build

    jato by grizzly03

    I finally got to run my jato. These trucks are stupid fast! I can't stop laughing! Talk about a missile on wheels! With the setup "as it is" any quick throttle and it just wheelies. Needs some work to get it to handle better. The suspension is way to soft for offroad. Front compresses way to easy and acts like a lawn dart. Looks good with the bigger rear tires but need to go smaller/lighter. Any wheel spin and it overpowers the light chassis with a gyro affect. Going with the same tires as the front, should fix that. Needs help in braking. Replaced stock servo with a 2070 and it helped but not enough. Anybody know of a mod or aftermarket setup that would help? I know the oversized offroad tires don't help. Also is there anyway to get the rear toe lower than the Traxxas 3-degree toe bar? I found RLChobbies has an anti squat block that says 2.8 degrees and 1/2 degree of toe in, I'm thinking of giving it a try or make my own toe bar.
    This is my first jato. I have always worked on t-maxx and revo platforms. Any ideas or comments are welcome.

  2. #2
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    I thought I saw you mention an Upcoming Jato off-road build in another thread. Looking good so far.
    To get more toe in, couldn’t you just use traxxas toe ink ends but make your own links with a piece of threaded rod of a shorter length?

  3. #3
    RC Champion grizzly03's Avatar
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    Thanks Dakratfink. Unfortunately the Jato doesn't use toe links. It only has camber links. The rear toe is fixed based on how the suspension pins are mounted. The joys of modding,LOL. I always seem to want a part I cannot find.

  4. #4
    RC Champion olds97_lss's Avatar
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    I got some hard anno'd revo shocks on my eJato with trencher 3.8's. I run it on 3S with a 3200kv motor and the hot racing steel single speed conversion. I don't have it geared stupid high as I like to be able to run in the grass and at the skate parks with it without overheating.

    With the socks, I have vdk in them with holes drilled to 1/16" and 80wt oil and rc raven jato springs. I also used some dubro super hd ends on the rear shocks to raise it up a bit so now it almost sits level when I'm not on the throttle. Gets around pretty good. I'm never on dirt though, so grip isn't a huge issue. Spins a lot in the grass. I also have the traxxas wheelie bar on it, but I cut it to be about 1" shorter so it didn't have so much leverage when cartwheeling to rip it off. I also have a brace for the rear tower as they like to snap if you land on the roof too hard... which I seem to do a lot.



    I had it as nitro with a 2.5R in it for a long time. Then it sat on the shelf and didn't get driven much. When I started running electric, I decided to convert it over and it made it fun again.

    Didn't really need to wrap the rear tires as they don't balloon too bad. I have an old set of 12mm wheels I had on there from my 4pede as I converted it to 17mm.
    https://www.youtube.com/c/olds97lss

  5. #5
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    Looks pretty cool. To keep it down though you could run an on board ez start system. All you need is an ez start 1. A suitable 2s lipo. A xl5 esc and a 3 channel controller. Plug the lipo into the esc plug esc into channel 3 and the power wires to the ez start. Tape/glue down the starter button to where its always on and then activate channel 3 to start remotely. That's what I'm working on with mine

  6. #6
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    Looks great with those tires, that's for sure!
    "Happiness depends upon ourselves." -Aristotle

  7. #7
    RC Champion grizzly03's Avatar
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    Thanks for the comments. I always liked the off-road jato look.
    Update:
    Replaced the Picco carb with a losi carb, couldn't get the linkage to work with the picco carb (picco had a longer pull). This losi 3.4 carb really is a drop-in upgrade for the stock carb.(Should be same with any Traxxas vehicle that uses the snap on ball link). Way easier than taking a carb and turning it down on a lathe.
    Haven't given up on these rear tires yet! Going to play around with suspension and see if I can get them to work. Seems to bounce around a lot and not act "plush". Going to order the RLC block and Hard-anodized GTR shocks. I wish I had a sandpit to run it in, I think it would be a perfect home to bash this guy!

  8. #8
    RC Champion olds97_lss's Avatar
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    Thinner oil in the shocks may help with the bouncing. I went too stiff on it and my stampede, made them really bouncy. Before drilling out the vdk, I was in no-mans land trying to figure out what would work. Got down to 30wt oil and it was still bouncy. The vdk pistons have very small holes. That's when I drilled them out to 1/16" and threw in some 80wt. Not it's pretty plush on compression, but rebounds without much lag.
    https://www.youtube.com/c/olds97lss

  9. #9
    RC Champion grizzly03's Avatar
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    I'm actually not getting any dampening in the rear stock shocks. Acts like a pogo stick. I've increased to 45wt and it helps. I'm also trying to figure out a setup for the GTR shocks when I get them. Would you know about how much of a change each piston size would make in shock oil weight?(going from stock pistons to GTR pistons). I was going to try without getting the VDK. The kit works good for the cantilever shock setups. I didn't know how well it would work with a standard shock setup. I remember jumping up to 70wt in my summit with the VDK.
    The stock jato pistons are 1.3mm and 1.4mm. The GTR pistons are .95mm,1mm, and 1.10mm. I only have 30,35,40,45, and 70wt oil. I was thinking of starting at either 35wt or 40wt with the 1mm pistons.
    Winter is coming quick here in NY, nitro season is almost done.

  10. #10
    RC Champion olds97_lss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grizzly03 View Post
    I'm actually not getting any dampening in the rear stock shocks. Acts like a pogo stick. I've increased to 45wt and it helps. I'm also trying to figure out a setup for the GTR shocks when I get them. Would you know about how much of a change each piston size would make in shock oil weight?(going from stock pistons to GTR pistons). I was going to try without getting the VDK. The kit works good for the cantilever shock setups. I didn't know how well it would work with a standard shock setup. I remember jumping up to 70wt in my summit with the VDK.
    The stock jato pistons are 1.3mm and 1.4mm. The GTR pistons are .95mm,1mm, and 1.10mm. I only have 30,35,40,45, and 70wt oil. I was thinking of starting at either 35wt or 40wt with the 1mm pistons.
    Winter is coming quick here in NY, nitro season is almost done.
    I can't recall what I ran before with standard revo shocks or what pistons I had in it at the time. I had the hard anno'd shocks on there for a while and would just dump the oil and add heavier/lighter to work. Never really looked to see what pistons were there until I installed the vdk.

    The 1/16" hole is quite large compared to the #1 vdk holes (1.1mm). I think 1/16" is about 1.6mm according to google and I needed 70-80wt to calm it down after drilling them out. I think I went down to 70wt after installing the rcraven dual rate springs instead of the traxxas blue/red springs. Made for a bit more plush feel.
    Last edited by olds97_lss; 10-14-2019 at 05:17 PM.
    https://www.youtube.com/c/olds97lss

  11. #11
    RC Champion grizzly03's Avatar
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    How are the RCRaven springs? I looked at their springs and they don't mention any kind of spring tension. Would they be better suited for a heavier or lighter vehicle? I'm running the stock white springs(green/pink). I got the front end working good w/the heavier oil. It's the back end that likes to kick up when I hit a big bump. It reminds me of my Tamiya Grasshopper I had when I was a kid.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by grizzly03 View Post
    jato by grizzly03

    I finally got to run my jato. These trucks are stupid fast! I can't stop laughing! Talk about a missile on wheels! With the setup "as it is" any quick throttle and it just wheelies. Needs some work to get it to handle better. The suspension is way to soft for offroad. Front compresses way to easy and acts like a lawn dart. Looks good with the bigger rear tires but need to go smaller/lighter. Any wheel spin and it overpowers the light chassis with a gyro affect. Going with the same tires as the front, should fix that. Needs help in braking. Replaced stock servo with a 2070 and it helped but not enough. Anybody know of a mod or aftermarket setup that would help? I know the oversized offroad tires don't help. Also is there anyway to get the rear toe lower than the Traxxas 3-degree toe bar? I found RLChobbies has an anti squat block that says 2.8 degrees and 1/2 degree of toe in, I'm thinking of giving it a try or make my own toe bar.
    This is my first jato. I have always worked on t-maxx and revo platforms. Any ideas or comments are welcome.
    That’s some set up. Those tires look very cool but heavy, did you make any adjustment on your Spur Gear. Or Pinion? Also which photo app are you using to post your Pic’s? I used Flicker and Google but only allows you to add a link not the actual photo.

  13. #13
    RC Champion grizzly03's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by REVO-KN-EVIL View Post
    Thatís some set up. Those tires look very cool but heavy, did you make any adjustment on your Spur Gear. Or Pinion? Also which photo app are you using to post your Picís? I used Flicker and Google but only allows you to add a link not the actual photo.
    Thanks. Nice catch, I thought I posted the gearing.
    20/58 stock is 24/54. I figured it out at my new gearing and tires it would be 64mph @40,000 rpm's.

    I use Flicker.

  14. #14
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    Is there a trick to getting the picture to post instead of the link?

  15. #15
    RC Champion olds97_lss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grizzly03 View Post
    How are the RCRaven springs? I looked at their springs and they don't mention any kind of spring tension. Would they be better suited for a heavier or lighter vehicle? I'm running the stock white springs(green/pink). I got the front end working good w/the heavier oil. It's the back end that likes to kick up when I hit a big bump. It reminds me of my Tamiya Grasshopper I had when I was a kid.
    Sorry I missed this. You probably already figured it out... I'm pretty sure the springs I'm using are for the stampede GTR's and are stiffer than most TRX springs to accommodate extra weight of the VG roll cage on the stampede. Their GTR revo springs would be way too stiff for the jato.
    https://www.youtube.com/c/olds97lss

  16. #16
    RC Champion grizzly03's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by olds97_lss View Post
    Sorry I missed this. You probably already figured it out... I'm pretty sure the springs I'm using are for the stampede GTR's and are stiffer than most TRX springs to accommodate extra weight of the VG roll cage on the stampede. Their GTR revo springs would be way too stiff for the jato.
    Thanks olds97. I purchased a VDK to see if I can use it to slow down the rear shocks rebound rate. I was going to get back into tuning how it handles, but I broke the carb.

  17. #17
    RC Champion olds97_lss's Avatar
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    FWIW, the holes in the pistons were too small and I drilled mine out to 1/16, then used 60wt I think in them. I did the same on the gtr's in my stampede 4x4 using the same springs but with 70wt.
    https://www.youtube.com/c/olds97lss

  18. #18
    RC Champion grizzly03's Avatar
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    Thanks for reminding me about the hole size, totally forgot. Especially since I have a set of GTR's.

  19. #19
    RC Champion grizzly03's Avatar
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    Broken Losi carb. 7mm bore


    Picco 26 carb turned on lathe to fit. 7.5mm bore


    Getting closer to needing the THS exhaust.

  20. #20
    RC Qualifier nebulous.cow's Avatar
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    Beautiful! Looks to fit like a glove! I always wanted to stuff bigger carbs onto some motors back in the day, but I lacked the lathe and lathe skills. Looks awesome! How hard is it to mount a carb body in a lathe?

    Did you have to mount it not 90 degrees to the engine to have room around the starter motor?

    Interested to hear how it tunes.

    My wheel set is delayed thanks to USPS, bummer. I was hoping to have the offroad jato ripping this weekend, but looks like it will be a while longer.

    Looking good buddy!
    -Mike

  21. #21
    RC Champion grizzly03's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nebulous.cow View Post
    Beautiful! Looks to fit like a glove! I always wanted to stuff bigger carbs onto some motors back in the day, but I lacked the lathe and lathe skills. Looks awesome! How hard is it to mount a carb body in a lathe?
    Not to bad if the fuel inlet comes off and a live center to help hold it.

    Did you have to mount it not 90 degrees to the engine to have room around the starter motor?
    Yup, had to turn slightly.

    Interested to hear how it tunes.
    It worked good before. actually easier than the OS. Originally made a plastic sleeve to adapt carb to block. It deformed when I removed to clean because of long term storage. Instead of fixing at the time, I put on the Losi carb. Made a new sleeve out of SS.

    My wheel set is delayed thanks to USPS, bummer. I was hoping to have the offroad jato ripping this weekend, but looks like it will be a while longer.
    That stinks. I'm waiting on parts too!

    Looking good buddy!
    Thanks
    Changing the rear toe and ant-squat now. Just finished the bearings in the steering. The only play now is in the servo itself. Testing it out tomorrow.

  22. #22
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    Is the picco carb that good? I was getting ready to drop the $ into the 21 TM y'all were talking about.

    Still have a Losi 3.4 carb not mounted on any car or truck.
    Last edited by cooleocool; 05-18-2020 at 01:03 AM. Reason: merge
    Slayer Pro, Slash VXL 4x4, Jato 3.3, Rustler 2.5

  23. #23
    RC Champion grizzly03's Avatar
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    Try the Losi carb before buying the 21tm. It makes tuning much easier and (at least for me) not so finicky.

    I broke my Losi carb (first pic in post #19) that's why i repaired my picco carb. I didn't get much run time on Losi carb to make a fair assessment. I did with the Picco. For some reason the Picco carb didn't need the daily tweak to the HSN setting. I was thinking the Losi was acting the same but its life was cut short. Oops!

    Never tried the OS carb on the TRX 3.3 engine. Personally the Picco and Losi are better at tuning than the stock Traxxas carb on the 3.3 engine. I have read that the OS carb is better than the stock carb too.

  24. #24
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    Thank you. Did send a friend request as I only see about 8 of us replying to these posts Holding of on buying with the oS 21 for $269. Still on flea bay
    Slayer Pro, Slash VXL 4x4, Jato 3.3, Rustler 2.5

  25. #25
    RC Champion grizzly03's Avatar
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    The cost is a hit on the wallet. If you didn't already have the Losi carb, I would say save the Losi carb money and put it toward the OS. I was happy with the bigger carb, since you already have it give it a go.

  26. #26
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    Will do. And report back. Thanks Grizzly
    Slayer Pro, Slash VXL 4x4, Jato 3.3, Rustler 2.5

  27. #27
    RC Champion olds97_lss's Avatar
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    I tried the losi carb when I had a 3.3 in my revo. It ran better, tuned fine, but started binding after a short while. I couldn't get the linkage/pivot/carb setup well enough I guess. I gave up on it after the 2nd time it ran away at half throttle because the TRS and servo weren't strong enough to close the carb. Sucks when you have to use a brick wall or a tree as your brakes. lol!

    In the jato though, it's a straight shot from the servo to the carb slider, so probably less likely to have issues.
    https://www.youtube.com/c/olds97lss

  28. #28
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    So maybe I will drop the Losi carb in my slayer, along with the ghost THS pipe I am procuring. No cheating, just a next door neighbor who is in to it.
    On my home made track.��

    But the binding y'all are talking about is real, on the throttle linkage?
    Last edited by cooleocool; 05-18-2020 at 01:03 AM. Reason: merge
    Slayer Pro, Slash VXL 4x4, Jato 3.3, Rustler 2.5

  29. #29
    RC Qualifier nebulous.cow's Avatar
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    Hey Grizzly, hate to ask, but got any suggestions you can share for suspension setup on the off road jato? I got those trenchers installed, and they're the perfect size. She's a wheelie monster that slings dirt the entire time. Brilliant! Even with stock gearing, it wasn't struggling at all, no heat issues.

    I figured I'd take the sway bars out, and use thinner shock oil first. It'll be mostly smooth off road surfaces, as opposed to running over boulders.

    Pretty hard to keep it pointed straight over all the bumps at the insane speed! Whole new car off road.

    -Mike

  30. #30
    RC Champion grizzly03's Avatar
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    Glad to hear!

    Not yet. I got a VDK to try out. I was going to try experimenting with it along with oil weight. Still need to order softer springs. My yard is bumpy, I need a softer setup. It bounces around way too much in the back end, but the stock front isn't bad.

    This article might help:Building-Ultimate-Off-Road-Jato-33

    Already changed the rear anti-squat to lowest 1.5į and rear toe to 3į. Rear sway bar removed. The bigger rear tires have no problem with grip.

  31. #31
    RC Qualifier nebulous.cow's Avatar
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    Yeah I saw that article, it's pretty helpful. I think I imagined driving my jato mostly on grass, packed dirt, maybe gravel too. The traction on the 2.2" tires is actually pretty good, it definitely has the forward bite it demands on the throttle. I actually put 60k diff fluid in it too, to help with unloading, and it did really well on street and off road so far.

    I just took the sway bars out to try that, should help with the bumps.

    Is the VDK the same one as the revo? Those pistons fit? I think it could do really well on the jato too, just needs the right oil weight... What weights have you tried so far? Since I figured I'd be driving it on mostly smooth ish surfaces, I figured I'd go a decent weight lower than stock, maybe 20 or so less than stock. I won't be doing monster jumps with it too.

    Tomorrow I should be able to take it out to the park for some brapping! Exciting. Thanks for the tips!

    -Mike

  32. #32
    RC Champion grizzly03's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nebulous.cow View Post
    ...Is the VDK the same one as the revo? Those pistons fit? I think it could do really well on the jato too, just needs the right oil weight... What weights have you tried so far? Since I figured I'd be driving it on mostly smooth ish surfaces, I figured I'd go a decent weight lower than stock, maybe 20 or so less than stock. I won't be doing monster jumps with it too...
    I haven't started on the shocks yet.

    It's the same kit. The only difference is the stock Jato piston holes are 1.3 & 1.4mm. I'm going to start by trying (drilling) 1/16 like Olds97 did but start with 30 weight oil (30w is stock). Then adjust from there. When I start I'll post anything I try. I have a lot of extra VDK pistons to try different hole sizes and shock oil 30,35,40,45 to mess with.

    I got the carb working good so I have been working on the Revo gearing. I have too many projects going on at once.LoL

  33. #33
    RC Qualifier nebulous.cow's Avatar
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    Revo gearing?

    The thing I am kinda bummed about on the jato is that the stock gearing maxes out the engine mount in one direction... I tried to get one spur size up and it doesn't fit.

    Can't you install the tiny spur gears from the revo in the jato for insanely tall gearing? And slap a 21tm in there and have a monster? Lol

    -Mike

  34. #34
    RC Champion grizzly03's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nebulous.cow View Post
    Revo gearing?
    LoL. I meant i'm working on my Revo 3.3. Changing the transmission ratio that's in it. Going from close ratio that's in there now to wide ratio.


    The thing I am kinda bummed about on the jato is that the stock gearing maxes out the engine mount in one direction... I tried to get one spur size up and it doesn't fit.
    Do you mean a smaller spur?

    Can't you install the tiny spur gears from the revo in the jato for insanely tall gearing? And slap a 21tm in there and have a monster? Lol
    I don't see why not. Not just the Revo gears. They use the same slipper on multiple vehicles. Just remember to change the clutch bell to match gear pitch.

  35. #35
    RC Qualifier nebulous.cow's Avatar
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    I actually wanted a bigger spur gear, for off roading and just to counter the reduced performance from altitude. Clutch bells are like 4x the price of spur gears, figured I'd try the spur first... Didn't work out.

    I've come to appreciate the wide gearing on the revo, it's much more at home with the OS too. IMO the 3.3 is just too small for the revo, which largely contributes to the heat and tuning issues. And if it would shift to 2nd, it would just bog off road. 21tm solved every single issue.

    I'll have to play with the gearing on the jato more. I lowered my gearing on the revo with a spur and I like it. Can't wait to bash the jato at the motocross track this weekend as well, it really wants to roll on road without the sway bars, but should be good on low traction surfaces.

    It's helpful to see how you've gone about the off road jato project.

    -Mike

  36. #36
    RC Champion olds97_lss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grizzly03 View Post
    I haven't started on the shocks yet.

    It's the same kit. The only difference is the stock Jato piston holes are 1.3 & 1.4mm. I'm going to start by trying (drilling) 1/16 like Olds97 did but start with 30 weight oil (30w is stock). Then adjust from there. When I start I'll post anything I try. I have a lot of extra VDK pistons to try different hole sizes and shock oil 30,35,40,45 to mess with.

    I got the carb working good so I have been working on the Revo gearing. I have too many projects going on at once.LoL
    I got goofed up on the sizes that come in the VDK, then are #1-1.1mm, #2-1.0mm and #3-.95mm. I usually use the #2's in my revos. 1/16" is about 4mm. So odds are, your going to have to start at 60wt to get something to work. My shock setup sheet is out of date as I have 80wt with red/blue jato springs. Not 100% sure what the red ones were as I'm not seeing one of the optional springs with that color. 5434 were blue.

    Either way, I have VG springs on it now, but not sure what oil. Likely 60-80wt though with the pistons drilled out to 1/16".
    https://www.youtube.com/c/olds97lss

  37. #37
    RC Champion grizzly03's Avatar
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    Thanks Olds, but you had it right. I worded it wrong. I was copying the drilling part. I have smaller bits instead of 1/16". I'm going to start with the #1&30w and go up in size from there. My bits are smaller than 64th's.

    Did you drill all 4 the same or did you try changing rebound by have two different sizes?

  38. #38
    RC Champion olds97_lss's Avatar
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    I drilled them all the same. Not sure if I mentioned it, but mine's electric now. Guessing the weight may differ from yours a bit and where the weight sits.

    I usually run a 7400mah 3S SMC lipo in it, which sits sideways in the middle of the chassis.
    https://www.youtube.com/c/olds97lss

  39. #39
    RC Champion grizzly03's Avatar
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    I Found It.

    The video I watched that got me hooked on the idea of building my own off-road Jato: /www.youtube.com/watch

    Side note: I wish I picked up a CVEC or BUKU pipe when they were still making them. At the time I thought they were more of a gimmick, than a performance part.

  40. #40
    RC Qualifier nebulous.cow's Avatar
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    Holy wow! Hahaha that's insane! Definitely what I want as well!

    There's gotta be other pipes that work just as well, or very close to. If I had to guess, that pipe looks like its a "top end" pipe, cus hes getting wheelies in second gear at like 30mph already lol. Shouldn't be hard to find a small block "high end" pipe though.

    I am enjoying the offroad jato though! The smaller 2.2 trenchers are awesome, and actually have a great amount of traction. Highly recommend if you want to keep the gearing tall, and not mess up the handling. Mine will definitely wheelie offroad through the bumps, but not quite like that video lol.

    I bet if we found the magic pipe for the offroad jato setup, it'd be an epic drop in mod for us all with the 3.3 motor! I will definitely look into drilling out the stock resonator like you mentioned to me before. Should be interesting.

    -Mike

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