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  1. #1
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    Better motor that fit vxl 3s esc? Or advice for a new combo

    Hello!

    My son have a rustler 4x4 vxl that is running very good on 3s except the motor get pretty hot fast since he also have bigger tires on it.

    Is it any other motor that would directly fit this truck and same time working just fine with the stock esc?
    Esc running just fine with the traxxas fan, but motor need to be managed everytime and it kinda ruin some of the fun.


    I could also consider another esc/motor combo that is good for 3s to get around the same speed as the stock setup, and i want it to fit in without modify the chassis or get too much stress on the driveline. Want a similar setup just without need to take breaks after every 5-10 min.

    Cheers

  2. #2
    RC Qualifier GotNoRice's Avatar
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    I would personally recommend upgrading to a new combo. If you had the old 2-pole velineon motor then maybe that could justify the motor-only upgrade but the newer 4-pole velineon (which is what you obviously have, since the Rustler 4x4 is still a pretty new vehicle) is good for it's size and not really any worse than comparable-size motors from other brands. You're not going to find a similar size and KV motor that somehow runs way cooler under the same conditions.

    Upgrading to a larger motor is the solution here. Larger motors almost always run cooler than smaller motors given the same load. Unfortunately just because your ESC doesn't get too hot with the current motor doesn't mean that won't be the case when running a bigger motor. Also the Velineon system uses 3.5mm bullets where the motor and ESC attach. Most motors are going to use 4mm, so at a minimum you would need cable adapters to use a different motor with the velineon ESC.

    I would recommend the Castle Mamba X and Castle 2400kv 1415 combo. This is very similar to the Castle Mamba Max Pro and Castle 2400kv 1415 combo that I used in my Stampede 4x4 for a very long time. It is very fast. You will need to upgrade to something like a 17t pinion in order to make up for the lower KV of the motor, but pinions are cheap. There are a lot of other combos with even bigger motors that are made with 1/8th scale vehicles in mind but those will require more modification to fit. The Castle Mamba X and Castle 2400kv 1415 combo is about as close as you can get to an 1/8th scale system without having to make significant modifications to your chassis, etc.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by GotNoRice View Post
    I would personally recommend upgrading to a new combo. If you had the old 2-pole velineon motor then maybe that could justify the motor-only upgrade but the newer 4-pole velineon (which is what you obviously have, since the Rustler 4x4 is still a pretty new vehicle) is good for it's size and not really any worse than comparable-size motors from other brands. You're not going to find a similar size and KV motor that somehow runs way cooler under the same conditions.

    Upgrading to a larger motor is the solution here. Larger motors almost always run cooler than smaller motors given the same load. Unfortunately just because your ESC doesn't get too hot with the current motor doesn't mean that won't be the case when running a bigger motor. Also the Velineon system uses 3.5mm bullets where the motor and ESC attach. Most motors are going to use 4mm, so at a minimum you would need cable adapters to use a different motor with the velineon ESC.

    I would recommend the Castle Mamba X and Castle 2400kv 1415 combo. This is very similar to the Castle Mamba Max Pro and Castle 2400kv 1415 combo that I used in my Stampede 4x4 for a very long time. It is very fast. You will need to upgrade to something like a 17t pinion in order to make up for the lower KV of the motor, but pinions are cheap. There are a lot of other combos with even bigger motors that are made with 1/8th scale vehicles in mind but those will require more modification to fit. The Castle Mamba X and Castle 2400kv 1415 combo is about as close as you can get to an 1/8th scale system without having to make significant modifications to your chassis, etc.
    Thanks for good advice, so bigger motor must be the way to go.
    Do you know what is different with this mamba x esc and the mamba Max pro? Motors seems to be the same, the price on this two combos is also the same.

    The diff gears handle bigger motors, since it’s the same as used in the e maxx that running mamba monster, but how did your drive shaft holding? Im sure you had steel cvd, consider to get traxxas cvd.
    So far the new stock plastic holding up very good on 3s, havent breaked one yet, but with this castle 2400kv with more torque i dont want to even try it with plastic shaft

  4. #4
    RC Champion olds97_lss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ray87 View Post
    Do you know what is different with this mamba x esc and the mamba Max pro? Motors seems to be the same, the price on this two combos is also the same.
    Pretty sure MMP was the predecessor to the MX. Having a hard time finding much for the MMP on castles site now.

    Now I'm trying to figure out what the difference is between the MX and MMX... lol! Guessing the MMX can handle more current, but pretty sure I was told from castle that it's a 120A esc when I asked them some stuff about it before. Both are 2S-6S. The MMX looks larger, the MX has an alloy case... yeah, not sure.

    I have the MMX in my savage flux hp driving the castle 2200kv sensored 4074 (1515) motor. Also have a couple of the sidewinder sct sv3 esc's that I don't even use as I replaced the one with a HW max10 sct in my stampede and only bought the second for the motor... which I no longer use either.
    Last edited by olds97_lss; 10-22-2019 at 03:17 PM.
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  5. #5
    RC Champion Dcuda69's Avatar
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    Some great suggestions here. Another option(cheaper) is to search around ebay. One of my favorite combos in my Slash 4x4 is the Hobbywing WP SC8(still available about $60)paired with a Kershaw Designs 2700kv motor in a 3674 can(unfortunately no longer available,I paid $40) On 3s it is fast, on 4s it really wants to go airborne. Never gets hot. There's some generic motors very similar on ebay. I've used the HW WP SC8 to run several motors without issue...currently running a big 4074 2150kv 1/8th in that heavy Slash on 3s and 4s...never breaks a sweat.

    The SC8(available from multiple vendors,I grabbed this an an example)

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/Ezrun-WP-SC...IAAOSwKMddXrx0

    No experience with this particular motor(again,an example I thought looked interesting) big can,relatively high kv,5mm shaft. Geared up around 18/54 should fly.

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/3674-2950KV...AAAOSwx4ddfQ~h
    Last edited by Dcuda69; 10-22-2019 at 05:36 PM.
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  6. #6
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    Yes hobbywing isnt bad, what other motors from hobbywing could be similar to the castle 1415?
    Want 3.17 shaft so i could just use the stock gears, because on a 5mm shaft i need new gears on the slipper too right?

  7. #7
    RC Champion Dcuda69's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ray87 View Post
    Yes hobbywing isnt bad, what other motors from hobbywing could be similar to the castle 1415?
    Want 3.17 shaft so i could just use the stock gears, because on a 5mm shaft i need new gears on the slipper too right?
    Personally I would want a 5mm shaft. There have been broken 3mm shafts on the 2400kv in the past. Pinions are cheap. No need to change the spur gear just be sure to buy 32 pitch pinions. I still run a plastic(stock type) spur with that 1/8th scale motor(5mm shaft)

    Not sure Hobbywing has a motor comparable to the 1415 2400kv. I know they have an 1/8th scale(4074 can) but nothing in a 3670 can(that I'm aware of). 3670/3674 2400-2800 kv is likely the best fit.....tons available on ebay. I have a few no names motors that I have tortured without issue.

    That Castle system is quality for sure but....... I have the HW WP SC8, a Traxxas/Castle 2400kv, a Kershaw 2700kv and a RC Gearshop 2150kv to choose from. $180ish total for all of it.

    Have to decide what you want and how much $$$ you want to spend. Heck...I have a great little basher Rustler that flat out flies running a ton of leftover parts. I have a total of $200 invested in it(less than that Castle setup)
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ray87 View Post
    Hello!

    My son have a rustler 4x4 vxl that is running very good on 3s except the motor get pretty hot fast since he also have bigger tires on it.

    Is it any other motor that would directly fit this truck and same time working just fine with the stock esc?
    Esc running just fine with the traxxas fan, but motor need to be managed everytime and it kinda ruin some of the fun.


    I could also consider another esc/motor combo that is good for 3s to get around the same speed as the stock setup, and i want it to fit in without modify the chassis or get too much stress on the driveline. Want a similar setup just without need to take breaks after every 5-10 min.

    Cheers
    I just picked up the castle sw4 ESC/motor combo. I have the basher edition as Iím running a 1/10 scale stadium truck. Iím new to the game, however this thing is a beast. The photos of the box have some info on what types of trucks are a good fit. Good luck!





    Rustler xl-5
    Upgrades:

    -Castle sidewinder 4 4600kv brushless/sensor ready motor, 1406 series basher edition
    -trencher 2.5 tires/ rear, stock xl-5 alias wheels and tires
    -RPM/nylon: bulk head, front bumper, front/rear shock towers, front/rear A-arms, and transmission cover
    -Traxxas: aluminum castor blocks, aluminum bell crank, and 2s lipo 5800mah 25c


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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by B3A5T1492 View Post
    I just picked up the castle sw4 ESC/motor combo. I have the basher edition as Iím running a 1/10 scale stadium truck. Iím new to the game, however this thing is a beast. The photos of the box have some info on what types of trucks are a good fit. Good luck!





    Rustler xl-5
    Upgrades:

    -Castle sidewinder 4 4600kv brushless/sensor ready motor, 1406 series basher edition
    -trencher 2.5 tires/ rear, stock xl-5 alias wheels and tires
    -RPM/nylon: bulk head, front bumper, front/rear shock towers, front/rear A-arms, and transmission cover
    -Traxxas: aluminum castor blocks, aluminum bell crank, and 2s lipo 5800mah 25c


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk




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  10. #10
    RC Qualifier GotNoRice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by B3A5T1492 View Post
    I just picked up the castle sw4 ESC/motor combo. I have the basher edition as I’m running a 1/10 scale stadium truck.
    Quote Originally Posted by B3A5T1492 View Post
    -Castle sidewinder 4 4600kv brushless/sensor ready motor, 1406 series basher edition
    The Castle 1406 4600kv motor is the same size if not smaller than the stock 4-pole velineon, but higher KV. Under the same conditions, it's more likely to run hotter than the stock motor. OP would need to gear down to accommodate the higher-KV, but stock 11t pinion is already very small. These higher-KV motors are mainly made for lighter-weight 2WD vehicles with smaller tires (buggy, SCT, etc) and/or people who are limited to 2S due to racing rules. They are really only good for 3S if you are doing speed runs, not for bashing, and certainly not for bashing using a 4x4 vehicle with large tires on 3s.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ray87 View Post
    My son have a rustler 4x4 vxl that is running very good on 3s except the motor get pretty hot fast since he also have bigger tires on it.
    On the last picture, the one that shows some of the various motors that come in combos with the Sidewinder 4, the combo with the 1410-3800kv and the combo with the 1415-2400kv are the only combos with motors that have any hope of running cooler than the stock velineon. The 1410-3800kv is still not too far off from the stock velineon. The 1415-2400kv is really the only one that would guarantee being able to run cooler. That is nice that they offer it in a combo with the SW4 though. I had recomended the 1415-2400kv with the Mamba X earlier but the OP could probably get by with the SW4 instead of the Mamba X and save some money.
    Last edited by GotNoRice; 10-26-2019 at 12:35 PM.

  11. #11
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    Thanks alot for the info, i understand it must be a 1415 2400kv if it going to be any improvments vs stock.
    Would check up where i can get a sw combo for the best price.
    I didnt consider sw earlier since i had in my mind that it was to little for 4x4 but never checked out sw4, castle making so many similar combos so it’s not easy to pick.
    I see my lhs have sidewinder 4 with 1415 2400kv for almost 100 dollar less the mamba x, the motors are the same but esc is the differences here? What more do i get to go for the more expensive mamba x combo?

  12. #12
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    The mamba X can handle up to 6s lipo versus 3s for the sidewinder 4. The mamba X has an 8a BEC versus 3a on the sidewinder 4, the mamba X is a sensored ESC versus sensorless on the sidewinder 4, and the mamba X has data logging which the sidewinder 4 doesnít. There are probably more things that I havenít listed, these are just the main ones I saw. Go to castle creations website for the full list.

  13. #13
    RC Qualifier GotNoRice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ray87 View Post
    I see my lhs have sidewinder 4 with 1415 2400kv for almost 100 dollar less the mamba x, the motors are the same but esc is the differences here? What more do i get to go for the more expensive mamba x combo?
    With the Mamba X you can use up to 4S with the 1415-2400kv, and you can use the motor in sensored mode. With the Sidewinder 4, you are going to be limited to 3S and you will have to run the motor sensorless (SW4 does not support sensored operation). The Mamba X also has an 8 amp BEC whereas the SW4 only has a 2 amp BEC.

    Sensored mode will give you smoother operation at very low speeds, whereas running in sensorless mode can give you some minor cogging at very low speeds, but it's not that big of a deal. The lower-amperage BEC shouldn't be a problem unless you are running a very power-hungry after-market steering servo.

  14. #14
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    Better motor that fit vxl 3s esc? Or advice for a new combo

    It is hard to find the 1415 sized 2400kv motor. I mainly checked on eBay.

    Would the 1515 size motor drop right in without ďanyĒ mods? Motor this size would have nooo problem spinning larger tires.


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    Last edited by MiniElmo; 10-27-2019 at 12:35 PM.

  15. #15
    RC Qualifier GotNoRice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MiniElmo View Post
    Would the 1515 size motor drop right in without ďanyĒ mods? Motor this size would have nooo problem spinning larger tires.
    What do you mean by "drop right in"? Which ESC did you want to use with the 1515? The 1515 size motors are larger than the 1415. That is what is nice about the 1415. The 1415 is a longer motor, but it's the same width as smaller motors like the stock Velineon motor, which is why it fits in a lot of vehicles very easily and also gives you more pinion choices. The 1515 is longer AND wider. I use a 1515-2200kv with a Mamba Monster X (different than Mamba X) in a Slash 4x4 chassis and I needed to bring the pinion up to 18t just to get it to fit. Any smaller of a pinion and the thicker/wider motor would hit the chassis before the gears would mesh. Also, the 1515 motors usually use 5.5mm bullet connectors whereas most smaller motors (including the 1415-2400kv motor) usually use 4mm bullet connectors. The Velineon motor and ESC use 3.5mm bullets. You would need at least a Mamba X to handle a 1515. The 1415 is already close to the limits of what the Sidewinder 4 can handle.

  16. #16
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    Better motor that fit vxl 3s esc? Or advice for a new combo

    I would use a castle esc that is compatible with the motor. Bu5 it sounds like 1415 is the way to go.

    I was able to find it on the castle creation website for 240 bucks. http://www.castlecreations.com/en/ma...bo-010-0160-01

    Anywhere else I can get cheaper? Check eBay- only a 1415 2400kv motor for $90. And did not see it on Amazon.

    Also what pinion gear should go with if I want it to be similar to stock gearing set up and running on 3s Lipo?

    Would these pinion gears fit the 1415 motor and mesh with the existing 54 tooth spur gear?
    https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?m...2F132702965965
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    Last edited by MiniElmo; 10-27-2019 at 08:43 PM.

  17. #17
    RC Qualifier GotNoRice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MiniElmo View Post
    I would use a castle esc that is compatible with the motor. Bu5 it sounds like 1415 is the way to go.

    I was able to find it on the castle creation website for 240 bucks. http://www.castlecreations.com/en/ma...bo-010-0160-01

    Anywhere else I can get cheaper?
    You can save about $95 if you go with the Sidewinder 4 instead. 3s max and no sensored mode operation but otherwise a very nice setup.

    http://www.castlecreations.com/en/si...or-010-0164-07

    Quote Originally Posted by MiniElmo View Post
    Also what pinion gear should go with if I want it to be similar to stock gearing set up and running on 3s Lipo?

    Would these pinion gears fit the 1415 motor and mesh with the existing 54 tooth spur gear?
    https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?m...2F132702965965
    You need 32p pinions, so yeah those pinions should be fine. The 1415-2400kv comes in two versions. The "regular" version uses a 3.17mm shaft, same as the stock velineon and other smaller motors. There is also a version of the 1415-2400kv motor that has a 5mm shaft, same as bigger motors like the 1515. Make sure you know which version you are getting before you buy any pinions obviously. I would recommend 17 tooth as a starting point. If you get the version with the 3.17mm shaft, you can use the traxxas 17 tooth "optional" pinion that sometimes comes with the truck. Otherwise I'd recommend a Robinson Racing hardened pinion.

  18. #18
    RC Champion Dcuda69's Avatar
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    Sorry but.....why pair a 4s capable motor with a 3s max esc? That SW4 is only 3s max with 5v/2A BEC. The $60 HW WP SC8 is 4s capable with a 6V/3A BEC. I think the 6s capable Mamba stuff is overkill for most bashers but I sure don't want to be limited to 3s either. I've run 4s through my HW many times....it never flinches.
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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dcuda69 View Post
    Sorry but.....why pair a 4s capable motor with a 3s max esc? That SW4 is only 3s max with 5v/2A BEC. The $60 HW WP SC8 is 4s capable with a 6V/3A BEC. I think the 6s capable Mamba stuff is overkill for most bashers but I sure don't want to be limited to 3s either. I've run 4s through my HW many times....it never flinches.
    I second this thought. I have the same esc and itís just awesome. I also have an MMX in a Rustler. They both have there place. The HW runs a built P4de.


    Somehow builds are never done....

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by GotNoRice View Post
    With the Mamba X you can use up to 4S with the 1415-2400kv, and you can use the motor in sensored mode. With the Sidewinder 4, you are going to be limited to 3S and you will have to run the motor sensorless (SW4 does not support sensored operation). The Mamba X also has an 8 amp BEC whereas the SW4 only has a 2 amp BEC.

    Sensored mode will give you smoother operation at very low speeds, whereas running in sensorless mode can give you some minor cogging at very low speeds, but it's not that big of a deal. The lower-amperage BEC shouldn't be a problem unless you are running a very power-hungry after-market steering servo.
    Since im not going to use 4s i think this sidewinder would be enough for me.
    But the low a bec could be a issue maby?
    The stock servo is fine with trenchers, but i want fans on both motor and esc, is that a problem or are it going to be just fine?

    Yeah the cogging i know, the bigger gears the more it cog. Would be more smooth with sensor setup i agree, but maby just not worth it when 3s should be plenty of power in this smaller truck...

  21. #21
    RC Qualifier GotNoRice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dcuda69 View Post
    Sorry but.....why pair a 4s capable motor with a 3s max esc?
    I guess it depends on if you are actually going to run 4s. With a smaller vehicle 3s is still a lot. 3S will already break stock parts quickly using the stock VXL setup. Using 3S with the 1415-2400kv, geared appropriately to compensate for less KV, will be even harder on the stock parts. My Stampede 4x4 could do 100+ yard wheelies on 3S using the 1415-2400kv motor. I didn't even feel the need to try 4S with my 1415-2400kv setup until I converted my truck to a larger and heavier Slash 4x4 MT.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm all in favor of going overkill on the ESC. The SW4 combo does make it much more affordable to get the nice 1415-2400kv motor though. It only costs about $40 more for the SW4 combo than buying the 1415-2400kv motor itself. You can always upgrade the ESC later.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ray87 View Post
    Since im not going to use 4s i think this sidewinder would be enough for me.
    But the low a bec could be a issue maby?
    The stock servo is fine with trenchers, but i want fans on both motor and esc, is that a problem or are it going to be just fine?
    I've not yet personally used a Sidewinder 4, but I have vehicles with a Sidewinder 3 and Sidewinder 2 in them, both using a 2075 servo and several heatsink fans. It's never been an issue. Worst case scenario, you can just add an external BEC. You can find them for <$10 online.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by GotNoRice View Post
    I guess it depends on if you are actually going to run 4s. With a smaller vehicle 3s is still a lot. 3S will already break stock parts quickly using the stock VXL setup. Using 3S with the 1415-2400kv, geared appropriately to compensate for less KV, will be even harder on the stock parts. My Stampede 4x4 could do 100+ yard wheelies on 3S using the 1415-2400kv motor. I didn't even feel the need to try 4S with my 1415-2400kv setup until I converted my truck to a larger and heavier Slash 4x4 MT.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm all in favor of going overkill on the ESC. The SW4 combo does make it much more affordable to get the nice 1415-2400kv motor though. It only costs about $40 more for the SW4 combo than buying the 1415-2400kv motor itself. You can always upgrade the ESC later.



    I've not yet personally used a Sidewinder 4, but I have vehicles with a Sidewinder 3 and Sidewinder 2 in them, both using a 2075 servo and several heatsink fans. It's never been an issue. Worst case scenario, you can just add an external BEC. You can find them for <$10 online.
    That is great, do you know what type of screw i need and how long they must be to mount the motor?
    Esc i would need some kinda plate, then i just use the same type of double sided tape that is holding the esc in the e maxx.

  23. #23
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    The screws for your current motor should fit the new motor.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dcuda69 View Post
    Sorry but.....why pair a 4s capable motor with a 3s max esc? That SW4 is only 3s max with 5v/2A BEC. The $60 HW WP SC8 is 4s capable with a 6V/3A BEC. I think the 6s capable Mamba stuff is overkill for most bashers but I sure don't want to be limited to 3s either. I've run 4s through my HW many times....it never flinches.
    Is there a sensored version of the HW WP SC8 esc?


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  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by MiniElmo View Post
    Is there a sensored version of the HW WP SC8 esc?


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    Not that particular esc.


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  26. #26
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    Hello. I am extremely late.to the party here. So the four pole Velineon esc will run the 2400kv motor well. I did it for about a year. I prefer the Mamba X esc. The 2400kv motor is perfect for me. I have paired it with the Velineon, Mamba Max Pro and Mamba X esc's a d the motor performs excellently with them all. You already have a Velineon esc, get the motor and you're good. Upgrade your esc and you're really good
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